Many people feel that Singapore has being run like personal family business by the Lees. If this place is not country but a hotel or some people personal family business, there is no longer so called national service to talk about, it should call Lees' business service. The government should change National service to Lees' business service so to not confuse the people that this place is still running like nation because there's no nation to talk about.

How will young men feel when they have to being force to accept low wages and serve 2 years of Lees' business service? And how will those who had already served 2 or 2 1/2 years of Lees' business service who thought is national service and realised it's Lees' business service? Will anyone out there accept those kind of wages for 2 years to serve a family business?

Strongly think that lees family business service should not hide behind the good name of national service. How do you guys think?

I skip the part about NS because it been done to death. For Lee Inc, actually it is not a bad thing to run a country like a business, at least our economy is strong but sometime i feel singapore is abit soulless, as in we are over materialistic and need to be more liberal in certain areas.

I wish our culture can be fined tuned to make us more adventurous and creative thinking. I think our system is too rigid at times.

Bottomline..not bad lah, economy generally good, and security good. But still can improve some stuff. Also i feel Pap abit over dominance, i wish more parties can step up cause monopoly is never a good thing.

Originally posted by limpshaggy:
For Lee Inc, actually it is not a bad thing to run a country like a business, at least our economy is strong but sometime i feel singapore is abit soulless, as in we are over materialistic and need to be more liberal in certain areas.

Not a bad thing to run country like a business? You mean they can go unaccounted and without transpancy for the money they have received from people and treat it thier own money and spend whatever they like?

Next time I am going to serve the president, not the Lee Inc.

Originally posted by Darkness_hacker99:

Next time I am going to serve the president, not the Lee Inc.

The president is obedient and he is chosen because he's obedient to the Lees.
The Lees need obedience to run for them not righteous men. Have you not heard of obedient dogs and the running dogs? People calling them PAP running dogs. Serving president today is no different from serving the Lees.

just finish the 2 years and fuck off asap!

Atually it is not a bad thing to run a country like a business

It is actually Lee's Dynasty.

Father Son later Grandson ...

The government (Lees) do not need to account to the citizens the financial doings of the GIC and Temasek Holding. Why?

Cos the state-owned companies' money to the Government money PAP money Lee's family money.

I wish our culture can be fined tuned to make us more adventurous and creative thinking.

Regime, not culture.

actually it is not a bad thing to run a country like a business

Business is business. State is state. They are two different things.

One have no loyalty to business organisation.

If you run a state like a business, I think it will lead to its collapse.

Originally posted by Spartans:

It is actually Lee's Dynasty.

Father Son later Grandson ...

The government (Lees) do not need to account to the citizens the financial doings of the GIC and Temasek Holding. Why?

Cos the state-owned companies' money to the Government money PAP money Lee's family money.

Where does the money come from? It's the tax payers

As for NS... It's a national obligation, you defend for it

Originally posted by sbst275:

Where does the money come from? It's the tax payers

As for NS... It's a national obligation, you defend for it

Singapore is run like personal family business, what nation are there to talk about?

Originally posted by (human):


Singapore is run like personal family business, what [b]nation are there to talk about?[/b]

state and who runs it are two different things

dun try and mix the two things and make a hoo ha over it

Originally posted by sbst275:

state and who runs it are two different things

dun try and mix the two things and make a hoo ha over it

If it's a state, then people who run it like personal family business are national bandits. The day is here: national servants have turned into national bandits!

Originally posted by (human):

Not a bad thing to run country like a business? You mean they can go unaccounted and without transpancy for the money they have received from people and treat it thier own money and spend whatever they like?

Who says that a business is necessarily un-transparent and unaccountable?

Agree that the govt needs to work harder to communicate effectively with the citizens and make more effort to engage and explain policies rather than to rubber stamp them and shove it down the pple's throat...

But that said, it would seem easier to me, to have a country run properly like a profitable business and work on transparency, then to have transparency but no profitability...

If SG is not "profitable", then its not just the govt... We're ALL in trouble...

Communication - None.

All price hike are executed with or without your approval although you are paying for it.

The feedback sessions before implementation are all wayang and serving no purpose but to waste more money.

Transparency - How to ?

If there are any profit, it is already been distributed to all the poodles in the dog house, where got any for the silly peasants.

If there is any loss, just increase the tax and price to recruit more capital and still paying shameless bonus to the poodles for their boot licking and wagging of tails.

The peasants are just leaving the life of the forefathers as slave where all the warlords and their family are enjoying the shameless wealth obtained from the hard work.

Originally posted by Poh Ah Pak:

Business is business. State is state. They are two different things.

One have no loyalty to business organisation.

If you run a state like a business, I think it will lead to its collapse.

Exactly.

FCUKING HELL, MORE REASONS TO SKIP NS?

FCUKING HELL, DONT YOU KNOW ITS AN HONOUR TO SERVE YOUR NATION?

OPEN YOUR EYES DUDE, AND SEE THAT NS IS ONE THE GREATEST GLORY YOU CAN GET IN YOUR LIFE.

NATION ABOVE SELF, REMEMBER THAT.

Woah tone down infantry!

(human), as a Singaporean son, I think we all have an obligation to serve in its defence. When I served my NS, i know that I served to defend my family and friends here.

I would never want to see National Service abolished.

Originally posted by CX:

But that said, it would seem easier to me, to have a country run properly like a profitable business and work on transparency, then to have transparency but no profitability...

If SG is not "profitable", then its not just the govt... We're ALL in trouble...

I agree, I say we keep the govt profitable and not be transparent nvm the

masses they are vampires anyway

Originally posted by Shotgun:

Woah tone down infantry!

(human), as a Singaporean son, I think we all have an obligation to serve in its defence. When I served my NS, i know that I served to defend my family and friends here.

I would never want to see National Service abolished.

National Service is not wrong it's the bandits up there that is.

Originally posted by Shotgun:

Woah tone down infantry!

(human), as a Singaporean son, I think we all have an obligation to serve in its defence. When I served my NS, i know that I served to defend my family and friends here.

I would never want to see National Service abolished.

Totally agree. Singaporeans need to separate the state from the government.

Patriotism to the country does not mean support of the ruling party and vice versa.

For those people that think National Service is a joke, please watch Schindler's List or the Pianist. These are very real events that could have been Singapore. Without this deterrent measure, most countries wouldn't treat Singapore just like that. M'sia and Indon would be far more aggressive in stance.

And for taxpayer's monies, do you have a clue on how low taxes we are paying? My US and Aussie friends are shocked at the amount we're paying. GIC and Temasek gains have been reported. It must be noted that while losses have always been made of a higher profile, there has been sizeable gains, esp from GIC side. Temasek a little subjective over the past 2 years.

In any case, the government is growing its taxpayers' dollars through investment. Other countries such as S. Korea are following in its footsteps. Note that the other countries like NZ, Aus, US, UK substantial income tax earnings are not used for investment but to subsidize welfare. Imagine your hard earned dollars are being thrown to the fella who is too lazy to take care of himself.

I prefer Singapore very much more. Those unhappy can migrate to places with on average 30% tax, like in Aus. My friends in the US typically pay about 50% tax. Have fun.

One more aspect I would like to add.

My Indonesian colleague asked so what's the fuss about the ministers' salary, and I told him 3 million. He said, oh thats ok, our ministers get bribed by about 10 times that amount.

Originally posted by pwnz0r:

One more aspect I would like to add.

My Indonesian colleague asked so what's the fuss about the ministers' salary, and I told him 3 million. He said, oh thats ok, our ministers get bribed by about 10 times that amount.

Our ministers are paid highest in the world please do not compare with other 3rd world countries. Anyone expect Lees to end up like Suharto's fate in Singapore?

Originally posted by pwnz0r:

For those people that think National Service is a joke, please watch Schindler's List or the Pianist. These are very real events that could have been Singapore. Without this deterrent measure, most countries wouldn't treat Singapore just like that. M'sia and Indon would be far more aggressive in stance.

And for taxpayer's monies, do you have a clue on how low taxes we are paying? My US and Aussie friends are shocked at the amount we're paying. GIC and Temasek gains have been reported. It must be noted that while losses have always been made of a higher profile, there has been sizeable gains, esp from GIC side. Temasek a little subjective over the past 2 years.

In any case, the government is growing its taxpayers' dollars through investment. Other countries such as S. Korea are following in its footsteps. Note that the other countries like NZ, Aus, US, UK substantial income tax earnings are not used for investment but to subsidize welfare. Imagine your hard earned dollars are being thrown to the fella who is too lazy to take care of himself.

I prefer Singapore very much more. Those unhappy can migrate to places with on average 30% tax, like in Aus. My friends in the US typically pay about 50% tax. Have fun.

Your low tax argument seems flawed. What does low tax mean for Singaporeans? Most Singaporeans don't even pay taxes now, except for GST of 7% (most Singaporeans don't pay taxes before GST was implemented).

Other countries like NZ, Australia, US UK understands Economics, Business Cycles and Structural Unemployment. Do you even understand these concepts? Welfare maintains a basic standard of living for the unemployed. In Singapore, if your are unemployed, only avenue is beg, borrow, steal, pick up cardboard & aluminium cans or MRT tracks.

Your friends in the US pay 50% taxes must be more educated than you to realise the disparities. Despite having to pay 50% taxes, they are still willing to leave Singapore to enjoy a better quality of lifestyle. Most of my foreign educated friends all chose another western democracy to lead their lifestyle. Only ones whom I know that complain about other western democracies are those that are perpetually stucked in Singapore. More like sour grapes.



If you are interested in living in a country with low tax rates. Why not try the tax haven countries like British Virgin Island, Bahamas, Monaco, Cayman Island, Mauritius, ................?