Thinking Aloud replied by maurizio13 @ Thu, 01 May 2008 08:28:53 +0800

maurizio13 — Thu, 01 May 2008 08:28:53 +0800

likewise, i asked that you be put in a straitjacket and be kept in a padded cell.

Thinking Aloud replied by oxford mushroom @ Thu, 01 May 2008 08:16:36 +0800

oxford mushroom — Thu, 01 May 2008 08:16:36 +0800

After this incident, WKS would do well to put all prisoners in chains and strip them of all clothing like Guantanamo. Cancel all visitors contact and remove all toilet doors. They must do their business in the open like animals. Hard for them to escape anywhere with chains at their wrists and ankles. No more prison breaks.

Thinking Aloud replied by Lin Yu @ Thu, 01 May 2008 07:35:06 +0800

Lin Yu — Thu, 01 May 2008 07:35:06 +0800

Originally posted by PRP:

Lin Yu,

The writer is the politcal editor of ST.

Just because u disagree with some of her opinions,it doesn't mean the article is trash.

hmm......maybe I was another angry reader afterall

Thinking Aloud replied by PRP @ Wed, 30 Apr 2008 21:26:32 +0800

PRP — Wed, 30 Apr 2008 21:26:32 +0800

Lin Yu,

The writer is the politcal editor of ST.

Just because u disagree with some of her opinions,it doesn't mean the article is trash.

Thinking Aloud replied by Cowbaycowboo @ Sat, 26 Apr 2008 20:23:30 +0800

Cowbaycowboo — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 20:23:30 +0800

forget about how he escaped.....the minister should resign IF that Mas is never re-captured!!! since they gloated how good our security forces are....FIND THAT TERRORIST 1st!!!

Thinking Aloud replied by eagle @ Sat, 26 Apr 2008 19:42:12 +0800

eagle — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 19:42:12 +0800

Slap WKS with a "full donation of minister salary for 2 years" punishment

Can keep him in (PM happy) and can appease everyone a little.

Thinking Aloud replied by caleb_chiang @ Sat, 26 Apr 2008 19:38:37 +0800

caleb_chiang — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 19:38:37 +0800

erm… Too long to read… But if the minister failed in his duty to do his job, it would be his responsibility when it concern national security. If not, hire him to shake leg?

Thinking Aloud replied by 333225520 @ Sat, 26 Apr 2008 19:04:04 +0800

333225520 — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 19:04:04 +0800

Originally posted by Lin Yu:

Lastly, how could ST allows trash to be published. not only its content, the grammatical errors too.

ST wil publish any trash as long as it is in favour of the gov. Perhaps it is because most of the articles they are receiving are against the gov (which they can't use for some obvious reason...)?

Thinking Aloud replied by Lin Yu @ Sat, 26 Apr 2008 18:02:03 +0800

Lin Yu — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 18:02:03 +0800

Lastly, how could ST allows trash to be published. not only its content, the grammatical errors too.

Thinking Aloud replied by Lin Yu @ Sat, 26 Apr 2008 18:00:37 +0800

Lin Yu — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 18:00:37 +0800

Meanwhile, there really are many other things that I would rather focus my mind on.

I concur fully with the unionist G. Muthu Kumar, who said there are more important concerns for workers, like rising food costs. “People don’t bother about this Mas Selamat…..they’ve got no time to think about this,”

I respect the writer choice but these statement is poor in taste. This is my country and I have the duty to be concerned.

Thinking Aloud replied by Lin Yu @ Sat, 26 Apr 2008 17:57:37 +0800

Lin Yu — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 17:57:37 +0800

However, if the Government had waited for the disciplinary hearing results to be out before releasing details on the escape, Singaporean would still be waiting now. You pay your penny and you make your choice

I have to agree with this statement. You pay your penny and you make your choice. You vote them in and you live with it.

Thinking Aloud replied by Lin Yu @ Sat, 26 Apr 2008 17:54:24 +0800

Lin Yu — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 17:54:24 +0800

As for heads to roll – this is where you could say the Government made a tactical mistake.

It should have given full details of the disciplinary action to be taken at the same time as it gave details of the escape, rather than leaving the latter to a later date. This would have silenced the hounds baying for blood.

Still, that the Government did not do so was not because it had no disciplinary action planned, but because it wanted everything in its time. This is the orderly Government, after all.

How can there be a tactical mistake? PM pat DPM back and DPM pat Dir ISD back. everybody 没有事.

Head did roll. only the minnows

Thinking Aloud replied by Lin Yu @ Sat, 26 Apr 2008 17:49:25 +0800

Lin Yu — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 17:49:25 +0800

As recounted by the security specialist Michael Richardson in an article published in this newspaper on the March 28, Omar Al-Faruq, “one of the top Al-Qaeda leaders of South East Asia”, escaped in July 2005 with three others from the supposedly tightly guarded United States detention centre at Bagram airbase in Afghanistan.

When he escaped, the US was so embarrassed it did not disclose Faruq’s escape for some time.

“The news emerged only months later – during an army trial in November 2005, the US sergeant accused of mistreating Faruq in 2002,” said Richardson.

In Mas Selamat’s case, four hours, rather than four months, elapsed between the time of escape and the time of public disclosure.

Unlike the US Army, MHA informed the media on its own initiative, a fact I still marvel at. Time indeed is changing.

I'll give credits if MHA could keep it more more than 4 days. didn't the writer know that he was suppose to meet his family?

As for similarities in the US and the WRDC case, the sergeant and probably the GC and SDO bites the bullet

Thinking Aloud replied by Lin Yu @ Sat, 26 Apr 2008 17:44:09 +0800

Lin Yu — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 17:44:09 +0800

But the Mas Selamat escapes? What loss has there been, except that of face – mostly?

If he were a homicidal manic, there would be danger to the Singapore public. But he is not one.

Do we intent to wait until the chickens are hatched from the eggs ?

"if he is homicidal manic....". omg, did the writer know why he was detained in the first place? His ambition was to clash an aeroplance into Changi airport and more...

Thinking Aloud replied by Lin Yu @ Sat, 26 Apr 2008 17:39:11 +0800

Lin Yu — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 17:39:11 +0800

If a hospital was found to have been awarding tenders to its CEO’s family and friends, and the Health Minister knew but did nothing, the latter should be sacked, perhaps even charged with complicity.

any similarities? if an engineer can run a multi billions investment company?

would the writer join in the call like she claim?

Thinking Aloud replied by Lin Yu @ Sat, 26 Apr 2008 17:36:04 +0800

Lin Yu — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 17:36:04 +0800

This is not to say ministers should be immune. If a block of HDB flats was found to be unsafe, for instance, due to shoddy workmanship, I would join the call those calling for the minister to resign, even if he had not known about it.

How could that be? if her example above stands, then the responsible person should be the structual engineer if it is the structually unsafe. There! I'm not responsible again!

Thinking Aloud replied by Uncle Ver SG @ Sat, 26 Apr 2008 14:41:15 +0800

Uncle Ver SG — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 14:41:15 +0800

"Unlike the US Army, MHA informed the media on its own initiative, a fact I still marvel at. Time indeed is changing."

WTH, if you dont inform the public and there is even less chance of recapturing and news leak a couple of months later. It would have been worse and simply part of the political calculus of Singapore Inc.

"Officers who are responsible for Mas Selamat will be disciplined and penalized."

Please tell us how and by whom leh.

Funny the writer asked for Teo Chee Hean's head to roll. Being a woman, she would have never been in the army and does not know about all the dark secrets of the SAF. Actually abuse of power is pretty common and I am sure that everyone have known a casualty of training at some point.

Thinking Aloud replied by kilua @ Sat, 26 Apr 2008 14:19:12 +0800

kilua — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 14:19:12 +0800

Well the Singapore system works this way. If there is one credit for successes, one man deserves it. The states times would claim that the one man is responsible for the success of Singapore. But there is the failure, there is always the small Kahkia to blame for.

Its seems like is Singapore has the best deal for our leaders. Credit they take, blame the Kahkia takes.

Thinking Aloud replied by TooFree @ Sat, 26 Apr 2008 14:17:13 +0800

TooFree — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 14:17:13 +0800

I kind of agree to a certain degree with the introspective analysis provided by the article with examples and cite comparison of the Omar Al-Faruq's escape in order to examine the gravity of the issue.

The escape of JI member Mas Selamet Kastari could be viewed as a security breach or a lapse in operational procedure in the detention barrack. Both of which are easily prone to human error which needs to be further refine consistently on its operation procedure or reinforce on the security barriers by upgrading of technology alike.

Thinking Aloud replied by balance_else_complacent @ Sat, 26 Apr 2008 13:26:47 +0800

balance_else_complacent — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 13:26:47 +0800

I found a coincidence:

W K S

M S K

the ying being balanced?

Thinking Aloud replied by eagle @ Sat, 26 Apr 2008 13:07:42 +0800

eagle — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 13:07:42 +0800

comparing shoddy wiring and mental problem teacher with a national security issue that has dented Singapore's reputation seriously

hmmmm

Thinking Aloud replied by Lin Yu @ Sat, 26 Apr 2008 13:05:05 +0800

Lin Yu — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 13:05:05 +0800

If a fire should break out in an HDB block due to shoddy wiring, will the people the National Development to resign?

If a teacher with an undetected mental problem starts slashing at students in school, will the Education Minister have to resign?

In both cases, there will have been negligence- but does extend all the way up to the minister?

Common sense will tell you the buck has to stop somewhere, or there will be no ministers left in no time.

over here, her argment was that the minister should not be responsible because of the the Minister of National Development cannot be looking into shoddy wiring work (the HDB Project Manager is responsible) or the Education Minister cannot be responsible for the mental teachers because he don't employ the teacher (the principal is responsible).

Thinking Aloud replied by eagle @ Sat, 26 Apr 2008 12:57:32 +0800

eagle — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 12:57:32 +0800

I'm still going to point out one of WKS's closing statements

"We must support them"

Why must there be a 'we' and 'them' when WKS is Home Affairs Minister? And when Singaporeans are supposed to be united as one?

Thinking Aloud replied by Lin Yu @ Sat, 26 Apr 2008 12:55:16 +0800

Lin Yu — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 12:55:16 +0800

first......this whole article seems to be an angry woman ranting

Thinking Aloud replied by redDUST @ Sat, 26 Apr 2008 12:53:40 +0800

redDUST — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 12:53:40 +0800

Originally posted by Lin Yu:

I have read this article the Straits Times 26 April 2008 and nearly fell off the chair. As it cannot be found on the online Straits Times, I had to type this out. This article is full of flaws in her arguments as she tried in vain to explain the whole incident.

full mark for your efforts, lin yu!

what obvious flaws did you pick up? i actually tend to agree with her first two points. there are many detractors who do not read fully, but just as vicious in their diatribe. many have valid points, but these handful latch on the crtisicism wave and add fuel to the fire. they think they add on to the voice, but in fact they weaken's the argument put forth against.

As for the rest, i disagree with her. this is a serious lapse. the error is not a random error like a fire or a person's health in question. the dunking death is consequence of indisciplined officers, not a direct system's flaw. this, however is a direct consequence of a poorly executed or run detention centre that allow a terrorist to (plan for his) escape. mha and wks needs to take full responsibility. so far, wks seems to take the stand at arms' length of this fiasco. he has been disgraceful.

and her closing statement is narrow minded. can we not worry about rising cost and our security at the same time?

in the today newspaper, there is a great commentary written by a student on ltk's deafening silence. st also gives it prominence here. all inevitably weaken's his and wp's credibility. lhl, to his credit, saw the opening within seconds of ltk's silence and seize the situation to his favour. the opposition is fucked, by ltk no less.

we all have a disadvantage. our replies and comments can never be as measured and cohesive as the PAP's reply. we speak on our terms as individuals. hence, the opposition representation is critical, but alas proven to be just a squeky wheel. the opposition voice in parliament is muted, as exemplified by ltk.

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