2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by Vendettus @ Mon, 14 Jul 2008 18:55:33 +0800

Vendettus — Mon, 14 Jul 2008 18:55:33 +0800

Originally posted by Atobe:

If only the noisylion learn to observe in silence the words printed, and stop letting himself get drowned by his own noise, at least he may keep himself afloat.

Was any conclusions drawn from only one or two quarters, or were the quarters not compared to a forecast for the expected 2008 year-end result, which the Singapore economists already know the approximate outcome - given the set policies that his government insist on pursuing ?

Is the wage paid to the 7-Eleven staffer in Hong Konger any guide to the wages of any worker across the service industry ?

Have you ever wondered how the HongKongers can survive in their supposedly costlier environment at your speculated lower wages, and yet without any Political Party to drive the Hongkongers - they will collectively achieved such spectacular growth that the Singapore Ministers' can only dream of - despite being given the "Million Dollar crutch" that they need to prevent corruption in their ranks ?

Are the Public Housing in Hong Kong less affordable than Singapore's HDB units - which the lower income groups of Singapore continue to be dependent on rentals, despite the Government efforts to increase home-ownership ?

At the prices that the Singapore Government "fixed" the various prices for Goods and Services - and Public Housing - that Singaporean are made to depend on the monopolistic controls of the Government, and despite a supposedly better wages for the lower income - should we need to wonder how Hong Kong manage a lower Consumer Price Index in January 2008, when Singapore hit a 25-year record for our CPI at 6.6% ?

Average Selling Prices for Surplus HOS Flats 2007 Phase 1 Approved.

Average Selling Price for Suprlus HOS Flats 2007 – Page 1

Singapore CPI hits 6.6% in Jan 2008 – a new 25 year record high.

Hong Kong’s CPI Up 3.2% in January 2008

I think that was well said. Very well said indeed

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by Atobe @ Sun, 13 Jul 2008 02:17:08 +0800

Atobe — Sun, 13 Jul 2008 02:17:08 +0800

Originally posted by lionnoisy:

your reply involove many topics.

How did you so brilliantly see so many topics when the focus is to reply to your multiple points woven together in some senseless manner to create a noisy piece of regurgitated and poorly digested propaganda ?

There has been and remain only one main topic - Singapore' present poor economic performance compared to the glowing health of Hong Kong's economy.

7--eleven etc salary is a good indicators of HK economoy

This chain,together with other 4 chains,employ many pple in HK.

Can the wages of 7-Eleven employees be a good indicator of HK's economy to be compared with Singapore ?

Is the 7-Eleven employee even reflective of the real picture of Hong Kong's workers ?

With Hong Kong passing a legislation that guarantee a minimum wage. to even Filipino maids at HK$3,400 per month - are you expecting anyone to believe that the wages of the 7-Eleven employees - and across the Hong Kong workforce - will be lower then the maids ?

30 % of population in HK stays in rented Public housing

http://www.yearbook.gov.hk/2006/en/11_04.htm

SG has less than 10% of population stays in same type.

SG gavaman encourage pple to buy.

HK recently scrapped the rental pegged at 10% of medium income,

may be adjusted upwards or downewards.

In 2006,about 110,000 households needs to wait for 1.9 years

to get a rented flat,costing HK$ 250--3810 pm.

Do you even know who are the 30% Hongkongers who live in rented flats - which income group{s} do they represent ?

Are you suggesting that the 30% of Hongkongers living in rented Public Housing are all the equivalent to the under-Class Singaporeans living in rented ONE-Room HDB units ? Are you must be deluding yourself in your usual noisy ways ?

Have you seen the number of Classified Ads that also offer HDB flats for rent ?

Has the HDB not similarly adjusted the income levels to allow singles and married couples to rent excess HDB units ?

The fact that the Singapore Government prefer Singaporeans to buy the flats is obvious, considering the amount of profits that can be made from the sale of the HDB flats - with current 1000sq fr 4-room HDB new flats ranging from S$200,00 in Sengkang to $400,000 in Telok Blangah.

Do you believe that with the present HDB queuing scheme there is a shorter time than the 1.9 years waiting time experienced in Hongkong ?

Can HDB complete their building projects in less then 2 years ?

The areas of rental public housing range from few hundred to about

600 sq ft.

Sale of HK public flat----less than balance of 40 yrs in land lease

This type just like SG direct sale of HDB flat.

Many here complain SG 99 years.

Has the noisylion again deluded himself with his own noise, and forgotten to check the facts ?

Have you considered that the smallest HDB flat offered for rent in Singapore is the HDB 1-Room Flat Size : 26 sq M or approx. 260 sq ft is smaller than the 600 sq ft offered in the HongKong "public housing rental scheme" ?

Have you checked some of the remaining lease of some of the HDB units that are offered for resale ?

Did you check that even the brand new HDB Studio Apartments for elderly offered with 30 year lease are being offered for sale ?

HK is shorter,land lease runs up to 2047,less than balance of 40 yrs!!

can u suffer few hundred sq feet as shown in your link?

It costs S$100,000 in Tin Shiu Wai,famous for its remote

location and frequent family incidents.

It is also called 'Town of Sorrow''.

Have you checked the frequency of suicides in Singapore ?

A post in this Speakers' Corner in February 2008 had included the following:

2006: A total of 419 people committed suicide in 2006, up from 346 in 2003. The suicide rate per 100,000 residents - a sobering indicator in population statistics - is also on the upswing, growing from 9.3 in 2003 to 10.3 in 2006, figures from the Registry of Births and Deaths reveal. It is the fourth straight rise in as many years. (ST, Aug 13, 2007) (link)

If Tin Shiu Wai is given the title of Town of Sorrow for the suicide rates, should Singapore be given the sobriquet of being a "City of Sorrow" ?

if not, u have to pay S$175,000 for a 50 sq meter tiny unit in Sha Tin !!

Can u take the small size?

Perhaps the 26 sq M of an HDB ONE-Room flat will be suitable for a noisy cat living alone with his noise ?

HK pple suffer a lot from Park'N Shop and Wellcome supermarkets

and almost all shopping centers in public housing sold to

one company

They monopolyise the market,thanks to HK gavaman sold

ALL SHOPPING CENTERS IN PUBLIC HOUSING ESTATES!!

Imagine if HDB sells shopping centers in all estates to private company,

what would u do?

Are Singaporeans not made to be dependent to some supermarket chain named Fairprice, that has prices being anything but fair to the consumers who are the economic digits of the Singapore economy ?

Was HDB not the major landlord in Singapore for more then 30 odd years, until they forced all the tenants to purchase the old shop lots, rather then bear the cost of upgrading and renovations ?

Are the main shopping centers in Singapore not owned by Capital Land, or NTUC, or Temasek, or some other GLC ?

Now in HK.It is the case.What can HK pple do?

Protests?Done already.No change to the truth.

All have been sold.Protests in HK cant solve all the problems.

The HK gavaman sold all these because it needed $$.

Do your home work lah.My fren?

http://www.housingauthority.gov.hk/en/commercial/0,,,00.html

In November 2005, the Housing Authority (HA) divested 180 retail and car parking facilities to The Link Real Estate Investment Trust (The Link REIT). These properties are now run by The Link Management Limited, the company established for the purpose of managing The Link REIT.

Does the noisylion know what is an "Investment Trust" - and more so the purpose of a Real Estate Investment Trust ?

With your displayed intelligence in squawking everything and anything to promote your Singapore by deriding others - do you have any honor left in yourself compared to the cat that has far more honor then you as a human ?

U better read more HK papers and listen to their Call--ins

to know the prices of these chains.

They dominate in all public housing estates.

Here,NTUC Fairprice super. still have to worry votes every 5 years.

If you have been doing any reading yourself, it certainly have not been displayed in the responses that you have given todate.

It is either due to the Singapore education that you have received that has been determined to have the poor result of making the adult population being not literate.

INflations highest in so many years is because

PAP controlled the cost of living so well in the past!!

control almost all shopping centers in public housing

http://www.thelinkreit.com/

Are you admitting that the PAP has controlled the cost of living so well in the PAST - and NOT presently ?

If you do not understand what Real Estate Investment Trust - REIT is all about, the list you can do is to give some due diligence in educating yourself, and find out some information that would have saved you some usual embarrassment of falling flat on your own pile of crap.

The Link REIT is but one of amongst 7 REITs that were established in Hong Kong since 2005 - for the purpose of investment in properties as a Mutual Fund, whose shares are offered to the Hong Kong public.

Are you having any quarrel with Hong Kong's REIT - with The Link as your primary target ?

Do you know that The Link REIT is at least in private hands - in the manner that Hong Kong public hold shares in this Mutual Fund that is set up to develop and control properties ?

Unlike in Singapore, the main shareholders of the property holding companies are all Government Linked Companies, with the Board of Directors being appointees by the Government.

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by SingaporeTyrannosaur @ Sat, 12 Jul 2008 15:13:01 +0800

SingaporeTyrannosaur — Sat, 12 Jul 2008 15:13:01 +0800

lionnoisy, sounds like you have a case of serious inferiority complex about our country.

Only a person with inferiority complex sees the need to go about trying to find each and every single thing we are "better" in, even if the thing itself means very little.

Are you trying to compensate for Singapore in something?

An inferiority complex, in the fields of psychology and psychoanalysis, is a feeling that one is inferior to others in some way. Such feelings can arise from an imagined or actual inferiority in the afflicted person. It is often subconscious, and is thought to drive afflicted individuals to overcompensate, resulting either in spectacular achievement or extreme antisocial behavior, or both. Unlike a normal feeling of inferiority, which can act as an incentive for achievement, an inferiority complex is an advanced state of discouragement, often resulting in a retreat from difficulties.

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by lionnoisy @ Sat, 12 Jul 2008 10:51:11 +0800

lionnoisy — Sat, 12 Jul 2008 10:51:11 +0800

Originally posted by archon1234:

The HK equity market is around 4.5% of the global capitalization. On the other hand, Sg stack market is only 0.85% (20% o f HK capitalization). With all big banks lik Hong Kong Shang Hai Bank behind, and easy access + geographical promixity from China market and other Far east major market, HK is the destined capital market in ASIA. Sg is only surround by countries with "retail corruption" problem it is really draining on our growth space.

Share market is a double-edge sword.

Listen to www.rthk.org.hk the u know how many suffers huge loss

in the stock market.HK Gavaman wants to get stamp duty from the market.

Therefore it encourege pple gamble in it.

PAP dunt encourge pple play stocks.

Do u know in FOREX,SG is ahead of HK?

SG earn some from this market,FT live in SG,tax etc.

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by 00011000 @ Sat, 12 Jul 2008 10:33:57 +0800

00011000 — Sat, 12 Jul 2008 10:33:57 +0800

Originally posted by charlize:

Hey, our extraordinary leaders will make sure Singapore stays ahead.

But first, we need to increase their salaries again.

Singapore is slowly but surely becoming a gambling den.

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by Fingolfin_Noldor @ Fri, 11 Jul 2008 21:14:49 +0800

Fingolfin_Noldor — Fri, 11 Jul 2008 21:14:49 +0800

I think Lionoisy is forgetting that Hong Kong's sophistication as a market is way ahead of Singapore by many orders of magnitude.

Lest he forgets, the US is our no.2 trading partner. A fall in demand from the US is going to hit us quite badly. There are many things happening now that will change the dynamics of trade very soon. One of the things that I have read in say NYTimes is that export trade from the US had such an all time high in recent times, that there is a shortage in containers to export. With oil prices going higher, there stands a chance that some manufacturing will return to the US, and anyone with a decent common sense (which i'm sure some here lack) know what that means.

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by archon1234 @ Fri, 11 Jul 2008 18:33:26 +0800

archon1234 — Fri, 11 Jul 2008 18:33:26 +0800

Inflation is caused by influx of hot money in the system (with a fixed amount of resources). The demand increased, due to influx of hot monies, to compete with the fixed amount of resources available. The distribution of the resources will ultimately dependent on the monies that people willing to pay.

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by archon1234 @ Fri, 11 Jul 2008 18:27:59 +0800

archon1234 — Fri, 11 Jul 2008 18:27:59 +0800

The HK equity market is around 4.5% of the global capitalization. On the other hand, Sg stack market is only 0.85% (20% o f HK capitalization). With all big banks lik Hong Kong Shang Hai Bank behind, and easy access + geographical promixity from China market and other Far east major market, HK is the destined capital market in ASIA. Sg is only surround by countries with "retail corruption" problem it is really draining on our growth space.

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by charlize @ Thu, 10 Jul 2008 19:11:30 +0800

charlize — Thu, 10 Jul 2008 19:11:30 +0800

Hey, our extraordinary leaders will make sure Singapore stays ahead.

But first, we need to increase their salaries again.

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by SingaporeTyrannosaur @ Thu, 10 Jul 2008 15:20:11 +0800

SingaporeTyrannosaur — Thu, 10 Jul 2008 15:20:11 +0800

Survey shows Singapore lags Japan and Hong Kong as design hub

A recent survey has shown that while local design professionals and experts rate Singapore's design hub status as fair, most cite Japan and Hong Kong as better locations for engaging in design work.

This finding from a survey conducted by Spire Research and Consulting seems to reflect the superior "brand image" of these two countries over Singapore in the creative industries. The survey involved over 40 Singapore-based respondents who are either suppliers or customers in, or experts covering, the fields of communications, environment, fashion and industrial design. *

The respondents ranked Singapore just above China, South Korea and Thailand for design work as a whole. South Korea is said to be catching up with Japan in terms of design output quality, while Thailand and China are associated with price competitiveness.

The general sentiment of respondents is that South Korea, Thailand and China have the potential to catch up with or even surpass Singapore as design hubs.

Ratings for competitiveness of Singapore design work

Most respondents felt that Singapore design work has met the basic requirements. Some also believed Singapore possessed a pool of design talent with potential for greater development.

However, none of the respondents was optimistic about Singapore becoming a design hub in the short-term:

? More than 50 per cent of the respondents rated the quality of Singapore design work as reasonable and efficient
? Approximately 20 per cent also pointed out that Singapore had a ready pool of IT talent, which is advantageous for the design industry
? Over 90 per cent of respondents believed that Singapore designers still lack creativity and international exposure
? A frequently cited observation was that the work of Singapore designers reflected a "lack of identity"
? High labor costs and the lack of a nurturing environment for creativity were also cited as inhibiting factors
? More than 50 per cent of respondents felt the market for design in Singapore was too small and consumers generally had a preference for foreign design works
? Respondents rated Singapore design work on various attributes as follows:

Attributes of Singapore design output
Mean Score (on scale of 1-7, 1 being the best)
Creativity 3.6
Aesthetic Sense 3.7
Pride in Producing Quality Work 3.5

? When asked to cite the most competitive countries in the Asia Pacific for design work outside of Singapore, Japan emerged as the clear winner, cited by 72 per cent of respondents, followed at a distance by Hong Kong (31 per cent) and China (28 per cent). South Korea (10 per cent) and Thailand (7 per cent) were a distant 4th and 5th place

• While some respondents had experience of procuring or providing design work outside Singapore, most respondents might have been guided by impressions of the "design brand image" of these countries, based on published opinion and the views of industry colleagues

? In terms of pure quality of work, Japan received the highest mean score

Quality of design work done in countries
Mean Score (1-7, 1 being the best)
Japan 1.7
Hong Kong 2.7
Singapore 3.6
Thailand 3.8

Expert views on Singapore design work

The experts interviewed for this survey included faculty at leading universities and senior executives of design associations. These experts registered the following opinions:

? 70 per cent believed that the volume of design work commissioned in Singapore was increasing
? High costs, poor creativity and a weak sense of "identity" were the top reasons cited for commissioning design work overseas
? Some experts felt that Singaporeans were generally reluctant to consider design as a profession, thus limiting Singapore's potential as a design hub

What more can be done to position Singapore as a design hub?

? Nearly 60 per cent believed that the Singapore design sector was young and more organic development was needed before Singapore could aspire to be a design hub
? 50 per cent of the respondents felt that the current education system neglected the arts, particularly at the primary and secondary levels. They felt that the arts should be introduced at a younger age within the education system, so as to better nurture budding local talents
? The local designers surveyed wanted more support from local consumers for "designed in Singapore" products
? When asked what else the Singapore government and the design industry could do, respondents were mostly non-committal. Many felt that organic development should be allowed to take place, while some commented that:
• the government should provide financial support to designers wherever possible, for example through project-specific grants and access to funding for start-ups
• government and industry should support scholarships and exchange programs aimed at nurturing young designers
• local designers felt that the government should encourage more spending on local labels by awarding major projects to local firms, thus assisting them in gaining brand name recognition.

Conclusions

The community of customers and suppliers of design work in Singapore feel that the local design industry is doing a decent job. However in terms of its ambitions to become an international design hub, Singapore needs to start by being an Asia Pacific hub, and here it is in danger of being sandwiched by Japan and Hong Kong on the one hand and countries like Korea, Thailand and China on the other.

• Japan and Hong Kong are consistently associated with the best quality of design work, perhaps due to the associations these countries have with the creative industries as a result of their strong entertainment, fashion and merchandizing sectors. Japan's top ranking suggests that high labor costs need not inhibit the flourishing of the design industry

• Korea, Thailand and China are cited as up-and-coming design locations that can leverage lower labor costs as well as indigenous cultural traditions that are seen to benefit design creativity

Note that by now even Thailand has overtaken us...

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by SingaporeTyrannosaur @ Thu, 10 Jul 2008 15:16:44 +0800

SingaporeTyrannosaur — Thu, 10 Jul 2008 15:16:44 +0800

Hong Kong-vs-Singapore
Who is winning?

Last Sunday, I walked along Hong Kong's Causeway Bay and gained a new understanding of why Mr Lee Kuan Yew sometimes wishes Singaporeans were more like the people of Hong Kong.

What I saw was a carnival scene, a little organised chaos and a picture of flourishing business created from adversity.

Several streets around Victoria Park were packed with maids from Indonesia and the Philippines sitting around the pavements enjoying their day off.

It was like a huge picnic of more than 1,000 people eating lunch, chatting and listening to music. It is repeated every Sunday.

By the roadsides, mini-buses displayed photographs of maids seeking jobs. You could just walk up, interview one and sign her up without any bureaucratic fuss.

In Singapore, I quickly told myself, such scenes would not have been possible.

I'm pretty sure that Singaporeans by the hundreds would have complained to the authorities about the crowds and the noise; businessmen would want them removed for blocking their shops.

And in 10 minutes, the efficient Singapore police would have moved in and cleared everything away.

Well, that's what makes Hong Kong different. The former British colony is less regulated and a lot livelier.

Slowly, Singaporeans are learning that orderliness and tranquillity do not always spell economic opportunities.

Instead of getting the police to evict them, the Hong Kong shopkeepers did better. Instead of whining, they turned adversity into ringing cash registers and making money from the crowds.

"Kedai makanan" dished out Indonesian takeaways. Others sold Suara, a Jakarta newspaper, clothes and cosmetics, mobile phone products, from ring-tones to IDD discounts and money transfer services.

Several provision shops sold Indonesian goods. A dozen Indonesian girls were paid to distribute flyers at street corners.

But it was not only the people who stood out. The authorities, too, were tolerant in allowing small private entrepreneurs to do their stuff.

Faced with the same situation, the Singapore government would probably be handling it in a regulatory way. Break the law and you would get fined.

Hong Kong's laissez-faire did not leave with the British; the traditions of free private enterprise beat our city hands down.

Top-down Singapore, on the other hand, is just beginning to encourage a greater creative spirit among its 4.25 million population.

In the republic, many big businesses are controlled and run by the government. In Hong Kong, the city owns next to nothing.

Singaporeans generally aspire to get a degree and a high paying job, while their counterparts in Hong Kong dream of going into business and making a fortune.

Several years ago during a media forum, a newspaper editor asked for my assessment of the Hong Kong-Singapore rivalry.

The question was: "Who will win?" It is older than Singapore's independence; laissez-faire versus controlled economy, creativity against hard work and discipline, etc.

I've just returned from a six-day visit to Hong Kong's "conveyance belt" lifestyle and thought I would compare how restructuring Singapore is faring against it.

Its seven million people are used to lining up even to pay bills, finishing quickly and moving on. The queues are always long. Densely populated Singapore is only slightly better; that's why we call it a fishbowl.

The frequent comparisons are understandable. Both cities were once British trading posts without natural resources whose wealth lies within their peoples.

The contrasts, too, are just as great. One post-Sept 11 difference is in security threat. I immediately felt it upon arrival.

I left behind a Singapore, which was patrolled by special police armed with sub-machineguns. In Hong Kong, policemen at Tsim Sha Tsui helped lost tourists if they're not catching criminals.

Hong Kong, under China's rule for seven years, is free of this fear.

There's no national service. China protects the city and underwrites its defence, saving it billions in defence cost. Similarly for its foreign service.

These savings strengthen its competitiveness against Singapore and every one else. But it is the people who make the main difference. They are exceedingly more entrepreneurial and creative.

Singaporeans, on the other hand, are averse to business risks. They are generally better in their studies, make better professionals like engineers, scientists and mathematicians.

Every year, some 35,000 to 40,000 highly literate youths emerge from Singapore's education system with a one-track ambition to land a high paying job.

The island enjoys a powerful lead in the knowledge field and in skilled services - miles ahead in research and biotechnology.

Hong Kong, on the other hand, is 10 years ahead in the creative fields, including movies, TV, music and fashion.

Both cities want to be Asia's New York or London, but comparative advantage swings towards Hong Kong because of its lighter censorship and greater personal liberties.

...

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by lionnoisy @ Thu, 10 Jul 2008 14:42:41 +0800

lionnoisy — Thu, 10 Jul 2008 14:42:41 +0800

while SG is building the cruise terminals,HK's is not

in sight.no single project can earn SG a living.

But the sum of all projects can,bit by bit.

HK is so dependant on private housing that tenders

of this cruise terminals want include private housing,or so called

sale of hotel rooms,in this old KAI TAK airport mega project.

HKgavaman rejected them.

http://hk.news.yahoo.com/080709/318/2x5g7.html

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by lionnoisy @ Thu, 10 Jul 2008 14:06:55 +0800

lionnoisy — Thu, 10 Jul 2008 14:06:55 +0800

HK pple will tell u that they work for developers--for life!!

In HK,When 1 public flat is sold,another 3.5 units sold by private developers!!

u can say HK gavaman let the market decide the property market.

But i can say HK gavaman has not done enough to provide affording

housing to the public.

In SG,u can say HDB earns a lot.(In fact,it losts a lot).

In HK,the big 5 developers have earned billions !!

Read and think.Dunt just a copy cat.

http://www.yearbook.gov.hk/2006/en/11_01.htm

In December 2006, the total housing stock in Hong Kong amounted to 2 473 900 flats,

---comprising 715 700 public rental housing flats¹,

---397 800 subsidised home ownership flats and(lion note--sold units)

---1 360 300 flats in the private sector.(lion note--sold units)

About 30 per cent of Hong Kong's population live in public rental housing flats with another 18 per cent in subsidised home ownership flats.

i like SG partly socialism that private developers cant earn too

much.If u think HDB earns a lot,it is ok so long the $$ is in the accounts

but not in private accounts in Swiss banks,like other countries' $$.

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by lionnoisy @ Thu, 10 Jul 2008 13:53:22 +0800

lionnoisy — Thu, 10 Jul 2008 13:53:22 +0800

Originally posted by Atobe:

If only the noisylion learn to observe in silence the words printed, and stop letting himself get drowned by his own noise, at least he may keep himself afloat.

Was any conclusions drawn from only one or two quarters, or were the quarters not compared to a forecast for the expected 2008 year-end result, which the Singapore economists already know the approximate outcome - given the set policies that his government insist on pursuing ?

Is the wage paid to the 7-Eleven staffer in Hong Konger any guide to the wages of any worker across the service industry ?

Have you ever wondered how the HongKongers can survive in their supposedly costlier environment at your speculated lower wages, and yet without any Political Party to drive the Hongkongers - they will collectively achieved such spectacular growth that the Singapore Ministers' can only dream of - despite being given the "Million Dollar crutch" that they need to prevent corruption in their ranks ?

Are the Public Housing in Hong Kong less affordable than Singapore's HDB units - which the lower income groups of Singapore continue to be dependent on rentals, despite the Government efforts to increase home-ownership ?

At the prices that the Singapore Government "fixed" the various prices for Goods and Services - and Public Housing - that Singaporean are made to depend on the monopolistic controls of the Government, and despite a supposedly better wages for the lower income - should we need to wonder how Hong Kong manage a lower Consumer Price Index in January 2008, when Singapore hit a 25-year record for our CPI at 6.6% ?

Average Selling Prices for Surplus HOS Flats 2007 Phase 1 Approved.

Average Selling Price for Suprlus HOS Flats 2007 – Page 1

Singapore CPI hits 6.6% in Jan 2008 – a new 25 year record high.

Hong Kong’s CPI Up 3.2% in January 2008

your reply involove many topics.

7--eleven etc salary is a good indicators of HK economoy

This chain,together with other 4 chains,employ many pple in HK.

30 % of population in HK stays in rented Public housing

http://www.yearbook.gov.hk/2006/en/11_04.htm

SG has less than 10% of population stays in same type.

SG gavaman encourage pple to buy.

HK recently scrapped the rental pegged at 10% of medium income,

may be adjusted upwards or downewards.

In 2006,about 110,000 households needs to wait for 1.9 years

to get a rented flat,costing HK$ 250--3810 pm.

The areas of rental public housing range from few hundred to about

600 sq ft.

Sale of HK public flat----less than balance of 40 yrs in land lease

This type just like SG direct sale of HDB flat.

Many here complain SG 99 years.

HK is shorter,land lease runs up to 2047,less than balance of 40 yrs!!

can u suffer few hundred sq feet as shown in your link?

It costs S$100,000 in Tin Shiu Wai,famous for its remote

location and frequent family incidents.

It is also called 'Town of Sorrow''.

if not, u have to pay S$175,000 for a 50 sq meter tiny unit in Sha Tin !!

Can u take the small size?

HK pple suffer a lot from Park'N Shop and Wellcome supermarkets

and almost all shopping centers in public housing sold to

one company

They monopolyise the market,thanks to HK gavaman sold

ALL SHOPPING CENTERS IN PUBLIC HOUSING ESTATES!!

Imagine if HDB sells shopping centers in all estates to private company,

what would u do?

Now in HK.It is the case.What can HK pple do?

Protests?Done already.No change to the truth.

All have been sold.Protests in HK cant solve all the problems.

The HK gavaman sold all these because it needed $$.

Do your home work lah.My fren?

http://www.housingauthority.gov.hk/en/commercial/0,,,00.html

In November 2005, the Housing Authority (HA) divested 180 retail and car parking facilities to The Link Real Estate Investment Trust (The Link REIT). These properties are now run by The Link Management Limited, the company established for the purpose of managing The Link REIT.

U better read more HK papers and listen to their Call--ins

to know the prices of these chains.

They dominate in all public housing estates.

Here,NTUC Fairprice super. still have to worry votes every 5 years.

INflations highest in so many years is because

PAP controlled the cost of living so well in the past!!

control almost all shopping centers in public housing

http://www.thelinkreit.com/

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by Atobe @ Tue, 08 Jul 2008 07:33:53 +0800

Atobe — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 07:33:53 +0800

Originally posted by lionnoisy:

dunt just compare one or two quarters.i have said much

with the comparsions with 2 cities in other old threads.

do u know hourly salary in Hong Kong's 7- Eleven drops 5 %

in the past 10 years,at currenlty HK$21.50 per hours.(S$3.9 @ 5.5

exchange rate).For the big 5 supermarket chains,the average increase

in the past 10 years is HK$1.54 per hour!!If u calculate the inflations,

the purchase power sure drops!!

http://www.minwage.org.hk/

u can read some info for minimum wages which i do not

agree with this policy.

http://hk.news.yahoo.com/080706/12/2wvwa.html

The main expenses in a family is housing.

I think it is more affordable in SG than in HK.

If only the noisylion learn to observe in silence the words printed, and stop letting himself get drowned by his own noise, at least he may keep himself afloat.

Was any conclusions drawn from only one or two quarters, or were the quarters not compared to a forecast for the expected 2008 year-end result, which the Singapore economists already know the approximate outcome - given the set policies that his government insist on pursuing ?

Is the wage paid to the 7-Eleven staffer in Hong Konger any guide to the wages of any worker across the service industry ?

Have you ever wondered how the HongKongers can survive in their supposedly costlier environment at your speculated lower wages, and yet without any Political Party to drive the Hongkongers - they will collectively achieved such spectacular growth that the Singapore Ministers' can only dream of - despite being given the "Million Dollar crutch" that they need to prevent corruption in their ranks ?

Are the Public Housing in Hong Kong less affordable than Singapore's HDB units - which the lower income groups of Singapore continue to be dependent on rentals, despite the Government efforts to increase home-ownership ?

At the prices that the Singapore Government "fixed" the various prices for Goods and Services - and Public Housing - that Singaporean are made to depend on the monopolistic controls of the Government, and despite a supposedly better wages for the lower income - should we need to wonder how Hong Kong manage a lower Consumer Price Index in January 2008, when Singapore hit a 25-year record for our CPI at 6.6% ?

Average Selling Prices for Surplus HOS Flats 2007 Phase 1 Approved.

Average Selling Price for Suprlus HOS Flats 2007 – Page 1

Singapore CPI hits 6.6% in Jan 2008 – a new 25 year record high.

Hong Kong’s CPI Up 3.2% in January 2008

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by lionnoisy @ Mon, 07 Jul 2008 10:08:00 +0800

lionnoisy — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 10:08:00 +0800

dunt just compare one or two quarters.i have said much

with the comparsions with 2 cities in other old threads.

do u know hourly salary in Hong Kong's 7- Eleven drops 5 %

in the past 10 years,at currenlty HK$21.50 per hours.(S$3.9 @ 5.5

exchange rate).For the big 5 supermarket chains,the average increase

in the past 10 years is HK$1.54 per hour!!If u calculate the inflations,

the purchase power sure drops!!

http://www.minwage.org.hk/

u can read some info for minimum wages which i do not

agree with this policy.

5超市連鎖店時薪平均加1.54元

調查發現，1998年，7-11平均日間時薪約22.7元，今年為21.5元，減少1.2元；華潤超市的日間時薪雖由20.5元上升至22元，但平均時薪仍是7間連鎖企業中最低；惠康及百佳過去10年日間時薪分別上升0.6元及4.4元，增幅為2.7%及21.3%。

http://hk.news.yahoo.com/080706/12/2wvwa.html

The main expenses in a family is housing.

I think it is more affordable in SG than in HK.

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by dragg @ Mon, 07 Jul 2008 08:23:04 +0800

dragg — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 08:23:04 +0800

they just had a very good pay increase.

amazing!!!!

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by purpledragon84 @ Mon, 07 Jul 2008 08:01:19 +0800

purpledragon84 — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 08:01:19 +0800

and who was saying pop the champagne?

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by AndrewPKYap @ Mon, 07 Jul 2008 06:57:36 +0800

AndrewPKYap — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 06:57:36 +0800

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by Atobe @ Mon, 07 Jul 2008 06:56:49 +0800

Atobe — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 06:56:49 +0800

Poverty looms in Isle of Riches

Star, Malaysia
July 5, 2008

INSIGHT: BY SEAH CHIANG NEE

WHEN the republic celebrates its national day next month with its traditional stirring parade and patriotic songs, the mood of many of its citizens will be less than joyful.

On Aug 9 they will try to put aside an unusual combination of bad news – including crushing inflation and threat of a global recession – to wave flags and watch the fireworks.

But it will be with a heavy heart. To put it simply, Singapore’s 43rd birthday is coming at a bad time, possibly one of the worst in decades.

Ironically, the economy of the richest nation in South-East Asia had been firing on all cylinders in recent years.

A booming construction sector, record tourist arrivals and a fast-growing financial sector have contributed to a gross domestic product growth of nearly 8% last year.

The number of millionaires (in US dollar terms) increased to 77,000, making Singapore the seventh in the world in growth of people with high net worth.

That was the recent past. The present is less cheery. A Newsweek correspondent who visited here in 2007 asked: “If the island’s economy is booming, why are so many citizens worse off than they were 10 years ago?”

Even as the country prospered, the lives of lower middle class and the poor have become tougher over the past decade. It has in fact become bleak for the elderly and unskilled, who work as cleaners and labourers, admits the Ministry of Manpower.

Their wages have remained stagnant for 10 years, unlike other groups such as managers, professionals, sales and service workers, as well as plant and machine operators.

Last year, managers – the best-paid group – earned 4.86 times more than cleaners and labourers. The gap has widened in 10 years. It was 4.13 times in 1997.

A government committee on low-income earners says 300,000 workers, or 20% of the population earn S$1200 (RM2760) or less a month – half of them S$900 or less.

“Income gaps are widening,” said Finance Minister Tharman Shanmugaratnam, while Minister Mentor Lee Kuan Yew admitted that a narrowing was not likely any time soon because of cheap labour from China and India.

Inflation, the worst in 26 years, has further aggravated the problem since it is affecting the poorer class more than others.

The wage gap has become a particularly acute problem among older and lower-skilled workers, who are among the most disenchanted population in Singapore.

Commentators believe that the political fortunes of the ruling People’s Action Party (PAP) are tied to its ability to tackle this dilemma at a time when Lee's influential presence enters its sunset years.

If inflation worsens further or if the PAP cannot improve the lives of the middle class and the poor, it could face a crisis in the 2011 election.

An unusually frank write-up in the government-controlled Channel News Asia last year said that middle class stagnation could lead to social instability.

“Anecdotally, it seems to me that our society is already beginning to fray at the edges. There is an increasing coarseness to life,” the writer said.

“People have no more time to be considerate to others; even scavengers have to become pushy for fear of losing out to competitors.”

On a possible scenario if poverty spreads, he sounded a warning to the contended rich: “Even if you close your eyes to vagrants around us, you can’t avoid breathing the air that you share with them.

“Even if you drive around in a sealed BMW or Lexus, one day, homeless kids will catch up with you at traffic junctions offering to clean your windshield.

“Or you find yourself taking the long walk to your parked car, because the shorter route takes you past suspicious-looking men who might be desperate enough to snatch your bag.

“I wonder if the decay has begun to set in, even as we continue to boast of high GDP growth rates.”

The island state has become a rich oasis with pockets of rising poverty, where the homeless sleep at void decks or beaches.

Workers in their 60s or 70s clean toilets and sweep floors, instead of enjoying their retirement with grandchildren as is befitting the world’s seventh richest nation (in per capita GDP).

To say the government is not worried is understating the fact. It has set up a special body to study measures to improve the earnings of these 300,000 people.

Ideologically, Lee has always rejected subsidies or welfare schemes for the needy. The younger ministers, led by his son Prime Minister Lee Hsien Loong, have, however, been tweaking the no-welfare system by dishing out more cash and topping up savings of the lower-income workers.

Called Workfare, it provides hundreds to thousands of dollars to poorer families. Much of it has, however, been eaten up by the higher cost of living.

Some economists have called for a new social safety net to meet Singapore’s modern needs. Yeoh Lam Keong suggests identifying a basket of goods and services that is necessary for individuals and families to enjoy a minimum standard of living.

Based on this index, the government should formulate new policies to help low-income earners counter the effects of globalisation.

“We are in a strong fiscal position and if any country in the world can afford to find a better solution to deal with this growing income divide, it is Singapore,” Yeoh said.

o Seah Chiang Nee is a veteran journalist and editor of the information website littlespeck.com

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by AndrewPKYap @ Mon, 07 Jul 2008 06:55:45 +0800

AndrewPKYap — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 06:55:45 +0800

It seems to me that one of the reasons HK would do better is because, the despots took so much of the money that could have gone into private investment and lost it to foreigners.

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by AndrewPKYap @ Mon, 07 Jul 2008 06:52:50 +0800

AndrewPKYap — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 06:52:50 +0800

If people as dishonorable as the leegime in Singapore were to come to power (elected or appointed by China); Jacky Chan, Hsui Hark and other well-known HK personalities would likely lead protests and the foul-ups would either be kicked out or modify their dishonorable behavior.

In Singapore, the dishonorable people just arrest them. Full Stop, no discussion and continue to be dishonorable to the hilt.

Scum-bags through their propaganda would offer reasons for doing this and that but do you think you can trust scam artists that put in the pledge, "to build a democratic society" and promptly arrest anyone trying to exercise their democratic rights?

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by Atobe @ Mon, 07 Jul 2008 06:42:42 +0800

Atobe — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 06:42:42 +0800

With the burden of a slow economy that is making the economic outlook uncertain, and with crude oil prices affecting the cost of living - that was already negatively impacted with the 2006 increase in GST to 7% - it is amazing that this Government will continue to shrink the amount of money available to Singaporeans.

CPF, Medisave minimum sums to be raised from July 1

Channel News Asia
June 17, 2008
SINGAPORE

THERE will be changes to the CPF Minimum Sum, the Medisave Minimum Sum and the Medisave contribution ceiling from July 1.

The CPF Board said the new CPF Minimum Sum will be S$106,000, up from S$99,600 currently. CPF Members who set aside this amount will get a monthly payout of S$910 from age 64 for about 20 years.

The new Medisave Minimum Sum will be S$29,500, up from S$28,500.

The Medisave contribution ceiling, which is the maximum balance a CPF member may have in his Medisave account, will be raised from the current S$33,500 to S$34,500.

Any amount in excess of this will be transferred to the Special Account if the member is below 55 years old.

The CPF Board said these revisions are to ensure that Singaporeans have sufficient savings for their retirement and to meet their hospitalisation expenses.

The amounts have also been adjusted for inflation.

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by Atobe @ Mon, 07 Jul 2008 06:36:29 +0800

Atobe — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 06:36:29 +0800

As much as the propaganda machine attempt to generate the "feel good" effect - with cleverly dressed news release, they cannot cover the basic indicators that remains threatening to their ambitiously optimistic outlook.

Economists in MAS survey expect S’pore GDP to grow 5.5% in 2008

Channel News Asia
June 17, 2008
SINGAPORE

ECONOMISTS have become a little less optimistic about Singapore’s economic growth this year.

The latest survey of professional forecasters by the Monetary Authority of Singapore (MAS) shows that economists expect gross domestic product to grow 5.5 percent in 2008.

This is a slight downgrade from the 5.6 percent forecast made in the last survey in March.

But the second quarter appears to be doing well. Economists have raised their growth forecast for Q2 to 4.7 percent, up from the 4.4 percent reported in the previous survey.

However, inflation is expected to rise further this year, with the mean projection coming in at 6 percent, compared with the 5 percent three months ago.

More than half of the 21 respondents of the survey believe that inflation will fall within a range of 6 to 6.5 percent this year.

For the second quarter, inflation is expected to come in at 7.5 percent.

In the labour market, economists see the year-end unemployment rate at 2.2 percent, up slightly from the 2 percent in the March survey.

— CNA/so

2008 Economic Outlook - Sunshine in HK, storm clouds over SG replied by Atobe @ Mon, 07 Jul 2008 06:33:39 +0800

Atobe — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 06:33:39 +0800

Is Singapore heading in the right direction considering the differences in the government policies in Singapore and Hong Kong both competing in the face of challenges from a gloomy world economic outlook ?

Hong Kong has seen its 2008 First Quarter performance improved on its 2007 results, and with consumer confidence driving its local economy as much as it maintained its export sectors in several areas that Singapore is also competing in.

Hong Kong’s GDP Up 7.1 Pct in Q1

2008-05-16 - Xinhua

Hong Kong's economy continued to grow in the first quarter with its gross domestic product expanding 7.1 percent despite the growing adversities in the external environment, revealed the latest official figures on Friday.

KC Kwok, government economist of Hong Kong Special Administrative Region, said at a press conference here Friday that the GDP growth in the first three months marked the metropolis' 18th consecutive quarter that GDP growth exceeded the average trend growth.

Due to the uncertainties prevailing in the external environment and dimmer global economic prospects, Kwok said, the GDP forecast at 4 percent to 5 percent this year was still unchanged.

With the strong GDP growth in the first quarter, and barring any abrupt external shocks, it is likely GDP growth in 2008 should be close to the upper end of the forecast range, he said.

Total goods exports grew 8.3 percent in real terms in the first quarter, supported by the vibrant performance of the Chinese mainland and other emerging economies and the expansion of the European Union market.

Services exports also rose 10.8 percent in real terms on the back of a continued surge in financial services, as well as notable growth in offshore trade and inbound tourism.

Domestic demand played a key role in driving the economy forward. Private consumption spending rose 7.9 percent, underpinned by the firm labor-market conditions and rising incomes. Overall investment grew 8.9 percent with a rebound in building and construction activity.

However, amid dimmer global economic prospects, the local stock market experienced further consolidation in the first quarter and the housing market turned less hectic, Kwok said.

Labor market conditions continued to be firm in the first quarter. The seasonally adjusted unemployment rate stood at 3.4 percent, and the underemployment rate fell to a 10-year low of 1.9 percent. Labor earnings and wages were on the rise.

Consumer price inflation picked up, mostly due to the surge in food prices amid the global food inflation. Headline CPI inflation averaged 4.6 percent in the first quarter. After netting out the one-off effects of the rates concession this year and the public housing rental waiver last year, underlying CPI inflation was 4.9 percent.

Kwok said the external environment will remain uncertain and challenging, noting: "The US economy will continue to be weak with the effects of the housing market downturn spreading into the wider economy, while global financial markets are likely to remain unsettled. Economic activities in other major advanced economies have also showed signs of deceleration."

The growth momentum in the emerging and developing economies, including the Chinese mainland economy, is expected to remain vibrant, while there should be some mild moderation in growth due to the weaker demand from the advanced economies.

This should provide some cushioning effect on the impact on Hong Kong from the developed world's economic slowdown in the coming quarters, Kwok said.

Domestic demand is expected to grow and remain a key driver in economic growth. The firm labor market conditions and rising incomes should continue to fuel private consumption.

As business confidence holds up well and interest rates remain low, there should also be growth in investment spending in the rest of the year.

Kwok said the inflation outlook is also uncertain and will hinge on the movements in food prices in the international markets in the rest of the year, which can be expected to be volatile.

Apart from global food prices, the elevated international oil prices, the exchange-rate movements as well as the strength of the local economy are likely to continue to exert inflationary pressure. Nevertheless, the sustained increase in labor productivity will provide some offsetting effect.

Due to the high degree of uncertainties in the external environment, Kwok said, the forecast rate of increase in the underlying CPI for 2008 is maintained at 4.5 percent. The corresponding forecast headline inflation rate is also unchanged at 3.4 percent.

"The risks to these forecasts are on the upside. The government will review the inflation forecast as more incoming data become available," he added.

With the National Day celebrations approaching, Singapore is experiencing a tough period since the Election 2006 - and made worst with a slew of government approved price increases, and policies that contract the take-home pay of Singaporeans.

Is Singapore heading the right way with the government in the hands of PM LHL ?

Is he and his handpicked team of elitist talents managing the economy right, or are they merely guiding the economy on "auto-pilot" and making small corrections simply to keep the plane flying on course - regardless of the looming storm clouds ?

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