http://politics.sgforums.com/forums/10/topics/324332 en-US 60 <p>at first it is the people who put PAP in power. no doubt about that. however, after that, the shrewd lee slowly but surely remove that electoral right of the people by devising and revising the voting parameters to suit his own.</p> <p>post-lee period is where we will see the change.</p> <p>in fact, my take is when the lee regime ends (i.e. LHL faith departed as his father), singapore will go downhill from there as none of the lees' regime nor their cronies will be around anymore. the national coffers will be empty as they would have taken all the monies overseas. the lee's immediate families would have been long gone by then too, leaving in the states or uk. singapore will be left to fend for it self. with power concentration within a few despite all fronts about power succession, all wayang. we know mm goh was a seat warmer because LHL has cancer and isn't ready then.</p> <p>&nbsp;</p> Wed, 16 Jul 2008 16:26:54 +0800 politics.sgforums.com:10:324332:8246144 redDUST http://politics.sgforums.com/forums/10/topics/324332 <blockquote> <p>Is it the PAP's fault? Or is it the people's own fault? Or is it our forefathers fault?</p> </blockquote> <p>That is very clear.</p> <p>It is Lee Kuan Yew's policy to depoliticise the state and concentrate power into a small clique in PAP.</p> <p>That is completely clear.</p> <p>The main fault lies with the man <span style= "text-decoration: underline;">LEE KUAN YEW.</span></p> <p>That is perfectly clear.</p> Wed, 16 Jul 2008 16:07:48 +0800 politics.sgforums.com:10:324332:8246093 Poh Ah Pak http://politics.sgforums.com/forums/10/topics/324332 <blockquote> <div class="quote_from">Originally posted by ray245:</div> <div class="quote_body"> <p>Some of us seems to blame the PAP for having so much political power in singapore...but whose fault is it...to cultivate singaporeans into throwing so much support towards the PAP?</p> <p><span style="color: #ff0000;">The PAP did whatever it could to stay in power, including manipulating the Singaporeans into supporting the Party. I'm astounded at your naivete.</span></p> <p>Is it the PAP's fault? Or is it the people's own fault? Or is it our forefathers fault?</p> <p><span style="color: #ff0000;">Finger-pointing is so much more productive than thinking of ways to better the&nbsp; lives of citizens.</span></p> <p>It seems to me...that it is wrong to be too sucessful in doing what needs to be done at times.</p> <p><span style="color: #ff0000;">You've been very successful at trolling. Of course that's a good thing.</span></p> <p>During the early stage of the qing dynasty...that dynasty is so successful in fighting wars and maintaining peace...that people seems to think there is no room for improvement.</p> <p><span style="color: #ff0000;">Sounds like a certain organization in Singapore.</span></p> <p>Sadly...when the qing dynasty think of this..this is the era when the rest of the&nbsp;world (in this case europe) advance at a fast speed.</p> <p><span style="color: #ff0000;">You're right. I wonder whose political system is still stuck in the 50s with curtailed rights and freedoms.</span></p> <p>So whose fault is it, for the PAP to be so powerful? Is it really their own fault? Or are we responisble for it as well?</p> <p><span style="color: #ff0000;">It's the slaves fault for being enslaved! I mean, they could've escaped, couldn't they?</span></p> <p>Think about it. A butterfly can flap its wings in china...and that can cause a tornado in america.</p> <p><span style="color: #ff0000;">Very relevant to the discussion.</span></p> <p>Even the smallest actions can have the largest countereffect.</p> <p><span style="color: #ff0000;">A troll in sgforums will cause the collapse of the SGX tomorrow.</span></p> </div> </blockquote> <p>&nbsp;</p> Wed, 16 Jul 2008 12:06:12 +0800 politics.sgforums.com:10:324332:8245626 rooki http://politics.sgforums.com/forums/10/topics/324332 <blockquote> <div class="quote_from">Originally posted by ray245:</div> <div class="quote_body"> <p>Some of us seems to blame the PAP for having so much political power in singapore...but whose fault is it...to cultivate singaporeans into throwing so much support towards the PAP?</p> <p>&nbsp;</p> <p>Is it the PAP's fault? Or is it the people's own fault? Or is it our forefathers fault?</p> <p>&nbsp;</p> <p>It seems to me...that it is wrong to be too sucessful in doing what needs to be done at times.</p> <p>&nbsp;</p> <p>During the early stage of the qing dynasty...that dynasty is so successful in fighting wars and maintaining peace...that people seems to think there is no room for improvement.</p> <p>Sadly...when the qing dynasty think of this..this is the era when the rest of the&nbsp;world (in this case europe) advance at a fast speed.</p> <p>So whose fault is it, for the PAP to be so powerful? Is it really their own fault? Or are we responisble for it as well?</p> <p>Think about it. A butterfly can flap its wings in china...and that can cause a tornado in america.</p> <p>Even the smallest actions can have the largest countereffect.</p> </div> </blockquote> <p>Fault or not, I dare not say for fear for my life.</p> <p>1 thing which is&nbsp;a fact that I can say is</p> <p>without the People who voted them in,</p> <p>no matter how good or bad they are,</p> <p>they could never never never never have gotten into power.</p> <p>&nbsp;</p> Wed, 16 Jul 2008 11:26:03 +0800 politics.sgforums.com:10:324332:8245519 balance_else_complacent http://politics.sgforums.com/forums/10/topics/324332 <p><strong><span style="color: #ff0000;"><br /></span></strong></p> <p><strong><span style="color: #ff0000;"><br /></span></strong></p> <p><strong><span style="color: #ff0000;"><br /></span></strong></p> <p><strong><span style="color: #ff0000;">Is it like asking whether if it is the Zimbabweans fault that Robert Mugabe is still the pres of Zimbabwe.</span></strong></p> <p><strong><span style="color: #ff0000;"><br /></span></strong></p> <p><strong><span style="color: #ff0000;">Sure, the techniques Robert Mugabe used and the techniques the dishonorable Singapore despot used are different but the objectives are the same.<br /></span></strong></p> <p><strong><span style="color: #ff0000;"><br /></span></strong></p> <p><strong><span style="color: #ff0000;">You want to blame anyone, blame the public money grabbing despots.</span></strong></p> <p>&nbsp;</p> Wed, 16 Jul 2008 07:29:03 +0800 politics.sgforums.com:10:324332:8245165 AndrewPKYap http://politics.sgforums.com/forums/10/topics/324332 <p>.. I strongly feel and believe that, the people CANNOT be faulted at all...</p> <p>Why? Simply because A LOT of Singaporeans were unable to Vote for or against the so called 'our government'...</p> Wed, 16 Jul 2008 06:42:00 +0800 politics.sgforums.com:10:324332:8245158 HyperFocal http://politics.sgforums.com/forums/10/topics/324332 <p>Some of us seems to blame the PAP for having so much political power in singapore...but whose fault is it...to cultivate singaporeans into throwing so much support towards the PAP?</p> <p>&nbsp;</p> <p>Is it the PAP's fault? Or is it the people's own fault? Or is it our forefathers fault?</p> <p>&nbsp;</p> <p>It seems to me...that it is wrong to be too sucessful in doing what needs to be done at times.</p> <p>&nbsp;</p> <p>During the early stage of the qing dynasty...that dynasty is so successful in fighting wars and maintaining peace...that people seems to think there is no room for improvement.</p> <p>&nbsp;</p> <p>Sadly...when the qing dynasty think of this..this is the era when the rest of the&nbsp;world (in this case europe) advance at a fast speed.</p> <p>&nbsp;</p> <p>&nbsp;</p> <p>So whose fault is it, for the PAP to be so powerful? Is it really their own fault? Or are we responisble for it as well?</p> <p>&nbsp;</p> <p>Think about it. A butterfly can flap its wings in china...and that can cause a tornado in america.</p> <p>&nbsp;</p> <p>Even the smallest actions can have the largest countereffect.</p> <p>&nbsp;</p> <p>&nbsp;</p> Wed, 16 Jul 2008 00:28:13 +0800 politics.sgforums.com:10:324332:8244871 ray245 http://politics.sgforums.com/forums/10/topics/324332