Mx5 testdrive accident
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That makes sense.Originally posted by SpoonX:She was un familair with the test roads there as she is working at the bukit timah authorised agent and they got lost and ended up on that stretch..... -
can life really be that suay? small simple reasons that combine to take one's life? scary...Originally posted by SpoonX:She was un familair with the test roads there as she is working at the bukit timah authorised agent and they got lost and ended up on that stretch..... -
there is a BIG difference ah. while cornering sharply, if u step on the gas in a FWD car u understeer. u step on the gas in a RWD car u will oversteer.Originally posted by KangZ:Is there such a big difference between FWD and RWD cars? I admit there's a slight difference in feel when cornering, but that won't make me drive both cars differently... -
Yes.. the handling characteristics of the car changes alot..Originally posted by KangZ:Is there such a big difference between FWD and RWD cars? I admit there's a slight difference in feel when cornering, but that won't make me drive both cars differently...
Anyway I feel that fate plays a big part too...
For example, a FF car understeers easily, but a FR car oversteers instead.. You are right in the sense that fate plays a big part.. There are so many what ifs. what if the car didnt cut the MX lane. What if the road was not metal plating. What if they took another road instead.
No one plans for accidents to happen, but sometimes they do happen. -
This is what we call fate.....Originally posted by HENG@:can life really be that suay? small simple reasons that combine to take one's life? scary...
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Lastly i will not be repying to anymore comments.
I came in just to clairfy things as i read the asumptions and felt pretty unfair to the driver as well. I'm not saying he is not at fault.
Who right who wrong, raod metal or not, speeding or not it's no use to say liow.... Every one in this freak accident is a victim. Worse being the SE and her family. the driver also have to live with guilt for the rest of his life as he kept saying that he should be hanged for taking a life and jail is too light... Imagine the kind of mental torture while alive he too has to suffer.
Suay like u say they shouldn't be there in the first place as they are lost and ended up losing a life......... Fate maybe....
Cheers and drive safe!!! -
thanks for coming in to clear up some aspects of the accident. cheers.Originally posted by SpoonX:Lastly i will not be repying to anymore comments.
I came in just to clairfy things as i read the asumptions and felt pretty unfair to the driver as well. I'm not saying he is not at fault.
Who right who wrong, raod metal or not, speeding or not it's no use to say liow.... Every one in this freak accident is a victim. Worse being the SE and her family. the driver also have to live with guilt for the rest of his life as he kept saying that he should be hanged for taking a life and jail is too light... Imagine the kind of mental torture while alive he too has to suffer.
Suay like u say they shouldn't be there in the first place as they are lost and ended up losing a life......... Fate maybe....
Cheers and drive safe!!! -
she may haf seriously injured her neck as a result of e crash but who knows if she had oredi broken it or not.. anyway only she knows.Originally posted by nightsky87:Seriously, no offense at all, but does it make sense that the crash impact at the side the SE was sitting did not break her neck, but instead the passerby who took her out that broke her neck.. seems abit.. off-logic.. -
certainly thats quite a minor issue. it matters but since it didn't actually cause her death, its a slightly less pressing concern here.Originally posted by jonathan_n80:she may haf seriously injured her neck as a result of e crash but who knows if she had oredi broken it or not.. anyway only she knows. -
she died from heart attack i think.
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there's 1 thing i dont quite understand.
mx5 being a FR car, how would an FR car be unstable something to handle(published in the papers today) according to experts? -
Metal plates is part of the road condition which the driver need to adjust himself to, how can it be a factor, if it is that a problem, we have cars flipping at there like nobody business.Originally posted by nightsky87:Storywolf, relax.
No one wants accidents to happen.. No one is totally saying that it was caused by the metal plates.. you're right, if the metal plates were that much of a hazard we will have cars flipping at paya lebar like nobody's business.
Think he is just trying to say that the metal plates were a factor in the accident.. But not totally the cause..
As a driver, it is his duty to read the road condition, and surface condition, and take the appropriate measures , like slowing down speed to adjust for it. If others can do it, why are some people giving excuse for that damn driver. Failure to do that is still his mistake. -
I wonder who their motoring 'experts' are. The stability of the car also depends on the driver. But its not true that FR cars are 'unstable'Originally posted by bismarck:there's 1 thing i dont quite understand.
mx5 being a FR car, how would an FR car be unstable something to handle(published in the papers today) according to experts? -
Yup.. thanks for giving us an insight from the other side of the story.. Think we all appreciate it and we can learn something very important.Originally posted by SpoonX:Lastly i will not be repying to anymore comments.
I came in just to clairfy things as i read the asumptions and felt pretty unfair to the driver as well. I'm not saying he is not at fault.
Who right who wrong, raod metal or not, speeding or not it's no use to say liow.... Every one in this freak accident is a victim. Worse being the SE and her family. the driver also have to live with guilt for the rest of his life as he kept saying that he should be hanged for taking a life and jail is too light... Imagine the kind of mental torture while alive he too has to suffer.
Suay like u say they shouldn't be there in the first place as they are lost and ended up losing a life......... Fate maybe....
Cheers and drive safe!!! -
I just feel that you have no right to assume or take a concrete decision on the extent of the driver's mistake especially since you were not present during the incident.Originally posted by storywolf:Metal plates is part of the road condition which the driver need to adjust himself to, how can it be a factor, if it is that a problem, we have cars flipping at there like nobody business.
As a driver, it is his duty to read the road condition, and surface condition, and take the appropriate measures , like slowing down speed to adjust for it. If others can do it, why are some people giving excuse for that damn driver. Failure to do that is still his mistake.
I have driven through that metal platings there before during rainy days and I found my car (an FR) tail-fishing when I jammed the accelerator (ESP was activated so nothing happened).
You should consider if such an incident would happen had the driver swerved his car on ashpalt instead of metal plating. -
wah u dunno ah. MX-5 can be considered very unstable.Originally posted by bismarck:there's 1 thing i dont quite understand.
mx5 being a FR car, how would an FR car be unstable something to handle(published in the papers today) according to experts?
Short wheelbase
Lightweight = less inertia
fairly powerful RWD in a lightweight car
need i say more? -
Electronic Skid Protection?Originally posted by philia:I just feel that you have no right to assume or take a concrete decision on the extent of the driver's mistake especially since you were not present during the incident.
I have driven through that metal platings there before during rainy days and I found my car (an FR) tail-fishing when I jammed the accelerator (ESP was activated so nothing happened).
You should consider if such an incident would happen had the driver swerved his car on ashpalt instead of metal plating.
Yes, but the MX has DSC as well.. To lose control of the car even with DSC probably reflects something on the driving skills. If not the car.
The thing is, we were not at the scene and we were not in the car when it happened so we cannot really judge. -
its not just whether its FR or not. They missed out on a lot of major factors like wheelbase or curbweight. Everyone knows the MX-5 is a car designed to 'handle' as such it is set up to be rather 'nippy' around corners. Anyone who's driven a go kart(very short wheelbase, high bhp:weight ratio, nippy as hell) will know that a go kart's handling is excellent. But that also means its easy to overcook it into a corner, and spin or lose control in some way. Good handling does not equate to stability. As some WRC drivers commented on the Peugeot 206WRC in 2001: "it handles great but on the straights it is less stable than cars with a longer wheelbase (like the mitsu EVO or WRX)"Originally posted by nightsky87:I wonder who their motoring 'experts' are. The stability of the car also depends on the driver. But its not true that FR cars are 'unstable' -
If at low speed and with just a slight jerk or additional or decrease will sent out the butt, think thousand of accidents will happen. Then the road speed limit must lower liao, not increase as what LTA did.Originally posted by SpoonX:Looks like you dun really know your FR cars very well even after owning one..
You dun need to be at high speed to oversteer.. 30km to 40km will be more than enough... You think initail D ah??? How do u think drifting courses just wet the roads and the FR drivers just learn to drift by not even pulling hand brakes at low speeds of 40 to 50km/h???? A hard jerk on your steering and change in accelerator control will easily throw your butt to either sides on a slippery road for FR cars unless your car is equiped with traction control which sad to say even with traction control a unfamilar driver might not be able to counter steer back calmly.
Looking at the pictures of the miata and idiots will know its not a head on impact but the side impact that the bmw caused head on to...
2ndly, when the front slided 180degrees with no brakes on there is no traction as the wheels are most like lock in turn position and most drivers will already be stunned to do anything thus causing the speed to be faster the wat it is travelling while spiining due to CG forces.
3rdly, whe the front of the car finally slammed on the divider on the left side, the dirve shaft will break due to the impact on the rimm causeing the rim to have a super 45 degree positive camber effect... ( in simple terms the rims would have slantted inwards) thus causing the rims to act as a mini 45 degrees ram that will bring the car over the kerb.thus flipping the car like helicopter blades to the next lane and suay suay the bmw ramed onto the pessenger side of the miata head on causing the car to flip to the rear.
Lastly i get all these information of the accident from not only bystanders, but the van driver and the MX5 driver as well....
There are other more classified info not even disclosed to the media, the familiy of the gal and the test driver which i shall not disclosed here at all. Dun ask me how i know....
Lastly I'm not aloof guy and dun even know him neither am i the driver... Assume and speculate all you wan for all i care if that wat u are good for. For all i know now is I lost 1 fren permanently and the other will never be himself again. Sorry for being rude in my remarks.
PS. Know your car character on FR or FF or 4WD before you give any comments if not others will think that a FR car will not oversteer at low speed which is totally wrong and will neglect that fact as a slight jerk and even additional trottle or decrease will send the butt coming to the front and say hi to u even at low speed esp slippery roads.
I maybe an idiots, I may not know what oversteer or understeer, but I only know one thing, Speed Kills. By the way, will you see fatal accident in a traffic jam?? The answer is no, bacause all the car is dead slow.
Lastly I really feel sorry for both of your friend. -
Agree.. but the MX is not a new car.. It has been around for quite some time. If there were significant problems in handling, it won't have taken so long for something to happen, don't you think?Originally posted by HENG@:its not just whether its FR or not. They missed out on a lot of major factors like wheelbase or curbweight. Everyone knows the MX-5 is a car designed to 'handle' as such it is set up to be rather 'nippy' around corners. Anyone who's driven a go kart(very short wheelbase, high bhp:weight ratio, nippy as hell) will know that a go kart's handling is excellent. But that also means its easy to overcook it into a corner, and spin or lose control in some way. Good handling does not equate to stability. As some WRC drivers commented on the Peugeot 206WRC in 2001: "it handles great but on the straights it is less stable than cars with a longer wheelbase (like the mitsu EVO or WRX)" -
must say. the ESP n ABS in a merc is quite exceptional. I had to E-Brake a few times b4 (inconsiderate drivers cutting into my lane) while driving the Merc E-Class. The car stayed as straight as an arrow.Originally posted by nightsky87:Electronic Skid Protection? Your ride is a Mercedes?
Yes, but the MX has DSC as well.. To lose control of the car even with DSC probably reflects something on the driving skills. If not the car.
The thing is, we were not at the scene and we were not in the car when it happened so we cannot really judge. -
Tyres are a factor as well. Assuming the merc you drove in had Michelin tyres (Think they're stock with new mercs.. correct me if i'm wrong)Originally posted by HENG@:must say. the ESP n ABS in a merc is quite exceptional. I had to E-Brake a few times b4 (inconsiderate drivers cutting into my lane) while driving the Merc E-Class. The car stayed as straight as an arrow. -
I think ESP = Electronic Stability Program in a Mercedes. I am not saying it's not the driver's fault (he should shoulder some of the blame), but since he couldn't have gone too fast in heavy traffic and the car came fitted with stability control (maybe he turned it off) or maybe it's just the most basic form of stability control system w/o all the blings blings, perhaps there's sth wrong with the car itself... (can be hardware or software problem). Afterall it's a new model and some bugs are bound to be present.Originally posted by nightsky87:Electronic Skid Protection? Your ride is a Mercedes?
Yes, but the MX has DSC as well.. To lose control of the car even with DSC probably reflects something on the driving skills. If not the car.
The thing is, we were not at the scene and we were not in the car when it happened so we cannot really judge. -
You know damn right the merc esp is quite awesome. But I have to off it when I go tracking.Originally posted by HENG@:must say. the ESP n ABS in a merc is quite exceptional. I had to E-Brake a few times b4 (inconsiderate drivers cutting into my lane) while driving the Merc E-Class. The car stayed as straight as an arrow. -
anyways, i dunno why people are talking about the handling or stability. Its the bloody poor roll-over protection im worried about! like this, u have to wonder how an Audi TT will fare. Or worse, how about those new roadsters and cabriolet with those fancy pop-up roll over hoops will fare! U do realise that while NCAP regulates frontal n side impact protection, they don't regulate roll-over protection ya? Nobody regulates standards for roll-over protection in cars!Originally posted by nightsky87:Agree.. but the MX is not a new car.. It has been around for quite some time. If there were significant problems in handling, it won't have taken so long for something to happen, don't you think?