ERP ERP ERP
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Is cost of driving in Singapore the highest in the world?
The number of ERPs that Singapore government is setting up is now uncountable. To drive in Singapore, one needs to pay COE, road tax and now ERPs. With the recent increase in commodity prices - oil, rice, soya and electricity, singaporeans now have to face an increase in the number of ERP gantries and an increase in ERP prices.
Can government find a better time do it? or is it really necessary to implement all these gantries? has it proven to reduce traffic or has it just move traffic to a different timing? is this just another way for another division of singapore government to earn more money? do we not have enough money in our reserve considering singapore is one of the richest countries in the world?
???
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Actually, our ERP is not that bad compared to London. Their "ERP" called "Congestion Charge" is much worse. Because the hours are fixed, and there are long operation hours, like 7am-6pm kind of timings. And they have to pay 25 pounds to enter the city area. 25 pounds is about $75 Singapore dollars.
See how expensive their charge can get? The only advantage is that they charge the fee only once a day. So you can drive in and out on the same day without paying extra. But, how many times do you drive in and out of the city each day?
By the way, the 25 pounds is charged for vehicles with high CO2 emmisions only. The other normal cars pay 8 pounds. Which is still quite alot! 8 pounds is like $24 here. Its terrible if you pay $8 dollars in Singapore for ERP, so imagine they have to pay $24 to drive their average Honda Civic into London?
But if you drive a hybrid car, you do not need to pay the congestion charge. And their system is not as simple as putting the cashcard into the IU. They have to either, call a hotline to pay, sms a number to pay, pay at a self service kiosk, pay at a shop, or pay online. I personally would rather pay on the spot and at the very moment that I pass the gantry. It is a hassle to go online or call a hotline.
So though ERP is bad, other cities gets it worse than us. But after saying all this, I want to make it clear than I don't like high ERP charges also. But I'd rather pay ERP than to get stuck in a massive jam everyday. -
Your words are facts - I have relations residing in London and I know about them too.
But have you considered the cost of living in London with their gross pay factored in?
You have to measure it according to the economies of scale.
The best way to benchmark such situations would be the use of the percentile mark.
However, I would like to add that the city charge applies to only the city which is equivalent to the CBD cordon that we have in Singapore and that to me is perfectly fine.
It is implemented in every developed state to reduce gridlock in the streets within the CBD.
However - ERP is coming to the average man's estate. Is it justifiable? Or simply to prevent people from detouring and avoiding their current system?
Think tanks ahoy!
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Originally posted by Ferrari_RoXz:
Actually, our ERP is not that bad compared to London. Their "ERP" called "Congestion Charge" is much worse. Because the hours are fixed, and there are long operation hours, like 7am-6pm kind of timings. And they have to pay 25 pounds to enter the city area. 25 pounds is about $75 Singapore dollars.
See how expensive their charge can get? The only advantage is that they charge the fee only once a day. So you can drive in and out on the same day without paying extra. But, how many times do you drive in and out of the city each day?
By the way, the 25 pounds is charged for vehicles with high CO2 emmisions only. The other normal cars pay 8 pounds. Which is still quite alot! 8 pounds is like $24 here. Its terrible if you pay $8 dollars in Singapore for ERP, so imagine they have to pay $24 to drive their average Honda Civic into London?
But if you drive a hybrid car, you do not need to pay the congestion charge. And their system is not as simple as putting the cashcard into the IU. They have to either, call a hotline to pay, sms a number to pay, pay at a self service kiosk, pay at a shop, or pay online. I personally would rather pay on the spot and at the very moment that I pass the gantry. It is a hassle to go online or call a hotline.
So though ERP is bad, other cities gets it worse than us. But after saying all this, I want to make it clear than I don't like high ERP charges also. But I'd rather pay ERP than to get stuck in a massive jam everyday.+1, plus the petrol is damn expensive too.
Just the other day it was 1 Pound 14 per litre, but yesterday it rose a further 6 pence to 1 Pound 20! .That's already $3.60 at the exchange rate.
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Originally posted by ceecookie:
+1, plus the petrol is damn expensive too.
Just the other day it was 1 Pound 14 per litre, but yesterday it rose a further 6 pence to 1 Pound 20! .That's already $3.60 at the exchange rate.
The UK govt charge too much tax already. Charge so much yet the govt so crappy, they lost important documents 2 times in a week! Thank god we don't have this kind of problems. (or do we?) -
It's something we all can only wonder right?
We've got a ministerial position filled by a man blind in one eye, a man who said that he only serves as an advisor, offering advice in the press for millions annually.
And a man who let loose a man on the island with no remorse. Maybe he would feel the pain if his son was captured by the man himself.
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every road pay
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Originally posted by Ferrari_RoXz:
The UK govt charge too much tax already. Charge so much yet the govt so crappy, they lost important documents 2 times in a week! Thank god we don't have this kind of problems. (or do we?)Mas Selamat...
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they wanna raise raise raise price of driving........
but the public transport is not even good yet... people must be convinced that..
public transport =/= squeeze, sweat.
public transport =/= cannot enter train as a family, wife and son go in by one door, me & daughter by another door, baby & maid with pram another door.
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Originally posted by Ferrari_RoXz:
The UK govt charge too much tax already. Charge so much yet the govt so crappy, they lost important documents 2 times in a week! Thank god we don't have this kind of problems. (or do we?)We lost 2 lives, not 2 documents I guess =)
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Don't forget London is many times bigger than home.
Also - I think the ministers there are more diplomatic and democratic as compared to the ones at home. Furthermore, what blunders have they made?
Top on the list - escape of a high security convict.
Put these million dollar cronies in to power in London and they won't last a year.
No matter what - they will never be able to off lift me from the roads!
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Originally posted by jeez88:
Don't forget London is many times bigger than home.
Also - I think the ministers there are more diplomatic and democratic as compared to the ones at home. Furthermore, what blunders have they made?
Top on the list - escape of a high security convict.
Put these million dollar cronies in to power in London and they won't last a year.
No matter what - they will never be able to off lift me from the roads!
Happy paying then! :) The more you drive, the happier they will get. Who doesn't want more money? -
It's not about happily paying and what not.
It's more about the priceless value of convenience and comfort.
Trust me - once you get on the road by driving everyday, you'll know what I mean.
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u pay, u get convenience
u dun pay can.. get stuck in a jam and freaking feddup
see whcih way lor.
each way got its pro and cons
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Cycle to work....like me!
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London tube frequency is extremely high at about 2-3 mins apart. The tube covers the city so well you can walk from 1 station to the next in about 10 mins. It is also said that Hong Kong MTR has a higher frequency than Singapore and not as expensive as Singapore. Not sure if true. If only Singapore MRT can maintain that kind of frequency for the bus and trains than no one has to pack like sardines into overcrowded trains/bus like 3rd world (feels like 3rd world every morning). People will be happy to take public transport to enrich our monopolistic transport system. But from the news paper forums, we know the frequency is not that high, and it is not sustainable because there seems to be delays here and there every day. Cycling in Singapore weather and traffic is out of the question. Taxis are increasing the charge, Just took a cab from Capital Sq to Plaza Sing and it cost about $7. So all the price hikes by the transport companies, fuel companies, regulators, taxes - people feel the pinch
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I think S'pore MRT is not as bad as you guys pointed out to be. In London, almost everyday there will be delays, sometimes labeled as 'severe delays' at some of their lines. We are lucky that S'pore do not get such delays almost everyday.
I got my source of these delays from the London for transport website. Go check if you don't believe me. Londoners pay a much higher fare for their tube system compared to ours.
Though our MRT needs furthure improvements, I think it is comparable, if not better than most developed countries. -
Originally posted by Ferrari_RoXz:
I think S'pore MRT is not as bad as you guys pointed out to be. In London, almost everyday there will be delays, sometimes labeled as 'severe delays' at some of their lines. We are lucky that S'pore do not get such delays almost everyday.
I got my source of these delays from the London for transport website. Go check if you don't believe me. Londoners pay a much higher fare for their tube system compared to ours.
Though our MRT needs furthure improvements, I think it is comparable, if not better than most developed countries.Well, S'pore MRT do get delay once in while when someone jump onto the track. With the endless rising cost, I wouldn't be surprise if the frequency of such "delay" will start increasing too.
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Originally posted by Ferrari_RoXz:
I think S'pore MRT is not as bad as you guys pointed out to be. In London, almost everyday there will be delays, sometimes labeled as 'severe delays' at some of their lines. We are lucky that S'pore do not get such delays almost everyday.
I got my source of these delays from the London for transport website. Go check if you don't believe me. Londoners pay a much higher fare for their tube system compared to ours.
Though our MRT needs furthure improvements, I think it is comparable, if not better than most developed countries.so what if the frequency of our trains are at 2-3 mins. the thing is i can't board onto the first train that comes.
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Originally posted by alwaysdisturbed:
so what if the frequency of our trains are at 2-3 mins. the thing is i can't board onto the first train that comes.
Then wait for the next one. It won't kill you if you are late by 2-3 mins... you don't want SMRT to hire 'pushers' to push people on the train like they do in Tokyo right? If they hire pushers, everybody sure can get in the train wan. Everybody will then complain not of not getting onboard the train, but how they are treated like animals...
And then cases of molest will shoot up into outer space.
So its either you wait for the next train, or get pushed like sardines in cans. I'd rather wait for the next train, or the train after the next. -
Originally posted by Ferrari_RoXz:
Then wait for the next one. It won't kill you if you are late by 2-3 mins... you don't want SMRT to hire 'pushers' to push people on the train like they do in Tokyo right? If they hire pushers, everybody sure can get in the train wan. Everybody will then complain not of not getting onboard the train, but how they are treated like animals...
And then cases of molest will shoot up into outer space.
So its either you wait for the next train, or get pushed like sardines in cans. I'd rather wait for the next train, or the train after the next.i think i'm quite reasonable. if they had kept fares the same for the past decade. i wouldn't be complaining.
if they keep on increasing fares to claim for better service. i don't know where this 'better service' is.
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Originally posted by alwaysdisturbed:
i think i'm quite reasonable. if they had kept fares the same for the past decade. i wouldn't be complaining.
if they keep on increasing fares to claim for better service. i don't know where this 'better service' is.
You have to consider the operating cost now, and a decade ago. Oil prices are now at it's highest now. Surely you know that MRT runs on electricity. How is electricity produced? Oil. When it comes to mass transportation, oil is an unavoidable factor to consider.
At least SMRT tried to increase it's number of trains by 90 per week. This shows they are trying to do something to solve all the overcrowding complaints. And they have not (not yet) raised fares for it. SMRT is a company, not a charity, they need to make profits also. Sometime you must look in the company's point of view.
Thus, I think the point of comparison you made (a decade ago thing) is largely invalid because everything else, not only MRT prices, have increased. The only thing that decreased is prices of COE and road tax. -
Originally posted by Ferrari_RoXz:
Actually, our ERP is not that bad compared to London. Their "ERP" called "Congestion Charge" is much worse. Because the hours are fixed, and there are long operation hours, like 7am-6pm kind of timings. And they have to pay 25 pounds to enter the city area. 25 pounds is about $75 Singapore dollars.
See how expensive their charge can get? The only advantage is that they charge the fee only once a day. So you can drive in and out on the same day without paying extra. But, how many times do you drive in and out of the city each day?
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You make it sound like the erp hike is justified and there is a lot of room left for erp hikes?Do you know how much Londoners are earning compared to Asians?
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Gahmen getting eye soar at the riches of the citizen and wanna squeeze us dry...
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Originally posted by Ferrari_RoXz:
You have to consider the operating cost now, and a decade ago. Oil prices are now at it's highest now. Surely you know that MRT runs on electricity. How is electricity produced? Oil. When it comes to mass transportation, oil is an unavoidable factor to consider.
At least SMRT tried to increase it's number of trains by 90 per week. This shows they are trying to do something to solve all the overcrowding complaints. And they have not (not yet) raised fares for it. SMRT is a company, not a charity, they need to make profits also. Sometime you must look in the company's point of view.
Thus, I think the point of comparison you made (a decade ago thing) is largely invalid because everything else, not only MRT prices, have increased. The only thing that decreased is prices of COE and road tax.look at their profits over the years. and i believe the increase in ridership over the years could have covered all the increase in operating costs.
correct, COE and road tax are the only things that decrease. but there is a better way to squeeze now than COE and road tax which are 1 time payments.