City harvest invitation!!
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"17 of the 20 richest nations are Christian nations. 17 of the next 20 richest nations are Christian nations. This must be God-incidence!" - Rev Kong Hee
But the irony is that when these Christian nations become powerful comes the rise in Science and Philosophy and declining influence from the Church. And how about the fact that confucianist and buddhist China is arguably the richest and most powerful nation for 1500 years since birth of Christ?
"the West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact, non-Westerners never do." - Samuel Huntington -
Used to be a fellow christian in CHC but lots of parents whom are strict christians criticise about that church.Originally posted by libra_gal:hey guy!!anyone interested in going church this sunday??just a invitation to our church.u will enjoy it alot at the service with our fun in praising & worshiping our lord.. Juz come down and have a look.. non-believers or believers we welcome u.
Time 9am, 11.30 am & 2pm
venue: Jurong west St 91..
Bus no: 242 or 179 at boon lay interchange.
Hope to c u all there. -
I second that is not true. I have been to CHC twice or three times recently but they never force me to accept Christ. Or maybe it differs from cell group to cell group and age group? Perhaps your colleague is quite young and looks bulliable.Originally posted by ORIGAMIST:I just heard this an hour ago. So I come here to check it out. Tell me if the story is wrong.
One of my relative's colleague was invited to go the church. She was made to kneel down and stare at the floor. They were then asked if they acccept Christ. She did nothing and someone from behind her force her head down. Then they claimed that she had accepted Christ and ask her to contribute $50 to the church....
Don't spam me, I just repeat it for everybody benefit .....
About the pastor, I must admit, Kong is rather humorous but frankly speaking, his preaching are pretty shallow and very light on the brain (perhaps thats why many youths are attracted to this church). -
Cos some of the parent are quite old-fashion. Saying that Christian cannot do this and that. The modern concept of people mind is believing and seeing christian as a poor and for the folks to go. But in CHC is not, we believe GOd wants us to prosper that why we in that church are joyous people and most of them are quite rich. Btw, I don't reveal too much about other church. Some church does not allow to wear .... or read ... because they are demonic. Don't believe can ask your friend.
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somehow all that decadent trance-like joy sounds more like a crack den than a church.
wanna get rich work hard, pray how much also no use. don't believe me? u continue to dance around and i work hard 20 years down the road we compare. -
money is my religion
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i guess that above forumite's chc prosperity philosophy is but a naive figment of a mindless teen's fantasies about not working and money falling from the sky.
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Please do not associate Rich with Christianity.
Believes and $$$ do not go together. What you own on earth will own you when you depart to meet your judgement.
Just take care in what you believe in . -
sigh, think you guys should really try going to another church lah, dun accociate all church with a black sheep..........and well, to those which feel city harvest is too extream etc etc etc, just put it as those people had lost their common sense........really, true christian won't be here defending their church, they will not attempt to fight an accusation to their religion head on............that church in jurong is just one church lah, one church out of the many thousands in singapore, and incidently the one which have the most media attention and the most contreversies....
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more than 1/3 of the world's population is christian.. and that was in the year 2000 ... 37.9%
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Now I understand why it's called "city HARVEST"; they "harvest" funds from the city...
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This fella talk nonsense... Trying to be sacarstic n hurt other religions. The west r blood sucker, like to colonize other countries, suck them dry n leave the poor countries alone to fend for themselve tats why they so rich.Originally posted by teekh:"17 of the 20 richest nations are Christian nations. 17 of the next 20 richest nations are Christian nations. This must be God-incidence!" - Rev Kong Hee
But the irony is that when these Christian nations become powerful comes the rise in Science and Philosophy and declining influence from the Church. And how about the fact that confucianist and buddhist China is arguably the richest and most powerful nation for 1500 years since birth of Christ?
"the West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact, non-Westerners never do." - Samuel Huntington -
Wah Zombies !!!!
looks like a Resident Evil Movie !! -
ha, so the other churches' gods are fake? this is stupid.Originally posted by dO|pH|n3 a.k.a JaMiE:I understand how your feel and your yr think. Maybe not totally but I have the rough idea of what your thinking is. Different church got different purpose and mission. Something you don't like does not mean that something they do are wrong. Think about it, why do some of the churches are dying and instead of having people saved. The thing CHC does is totally different from other churches. One of the reason you say/critise them is because you don't understand what they are doing. You just base on what you see and what you get thoery. E.g Why do they worship like worship the devil or whatever. They aer worshipping a real God and mainly why other churches keep falling and falling is because they cannot feel the pressence. If you like a girl or a boy, would you tell yourself i love a bit or half., whether a bit of half, ITDOES NOT MATTER. The truth is you don't love her.. I take another example. Those who go singing or KTV always, do you sing half-dead as if you are dying or you sing with your heart and soul. What would you choose???
One more thing to say: Some of the thing is just based on what you see is what you get theory.E.g Understanding your parent . Don't tell you know everything. You can never understand them FULLY. When you say you know everything, actually you know nothing. -
Hmmm... how does fake gods look like???Originally posted by hxm:ha, so the other churches' gods are fake? this is stupid. -
i had a neighbour who PESTERED me for dunno how many weeks to go to the SO-CALLED CARNIVAL. in the end had to sit thru some SERVICE. n she told me she didn't KNOW about it. wtf??!?!?!?!?!? sorry no offense.Originally posted by ren3e:Hey CHC don't really recruit members.. People who went there are on their free will.. She don't promote her album nor concert in church.. Nothing u have heard is true.. If u really want to know the truth, don't ask people here.. Go to the church to find out the truth.. As by seeing & asking at the church will allow u to understand better.. People who see but don't ask will always condemn it..
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Originally posted by Ito_^:
what happens to the muslims and other religions?
Welcome to sgForums - the place of crazy critics, chc flamers and hys haters.
Anyways..
CHC Official Statement of Faith:
The fundamental teachings of this congregation are reflected in the following clear statements of faith:
1. We believe in the plenary-verbal inspiration of the accepted canon of scriptures as originally given. [b]The scriptures are infallible, inerrant and the sole and final authority for all matters of faith and conduct.
(2 Timothy 3:16; 1 Corinthians 2:13)
Personal Opinion: Please note that it says ".. accepted canon of scriptures as originally given."
2. We believe in the eternal Godhead who has revealed Himself as one God existing in three persons, Father, Son and Holy Spirit, distinguishable but indivisible.
(Matthew 28:19; 2 Corinthians 13:14)
3. We believe in the creation, test and fall of man as recorded in Genesis; his total spiritual depravity and inability to attain to divine righteousness.
(Romans 5:12, 1
4. We believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, the Savior of men, conceived by the Holy Spirit, born by the Virgin Mary, very God and very Man.
(Luke 1:26-35; John 1:14-18; Isaiah 7:14; 9:6)
5. We believe Christ died for our sins, was buried and rose again the third day, and personally appeared unto His disciples.
(1 Corinthians 15:1-4; Romans 4:25)
6. We believe in the bodily ascension of Jesus to heaven, His exaltation and personal, literal and bodily coming again the second time for His Church.
(John 14:2-3; and 1 Thessalonians 4:13-1
7. We believe in the salvation of sinners by grace, through repentance and faith in the perfect and sufficient work of the cross of Calvary by which we obtain remission of sins.
(Ephesians 2:8-9; Hebrews 9:12, 22; Romans 5:11)
Personal Opinion: Salvation by grace, repentance by faith and works. Simple enough?
8. We believe in the necessity of water baptism by immersion in the name of the eternal Godhead in order to fulfill the command of the Lord Jesus Christ.
(Matthew 28:19; Acts 2:34-36; 19:1-6)
9. We believe in the baptism in the Holy Spirit as a real experience at or subsequent to salvation, with the scriptural evidence, namely, speaking in other tongues as the Spirit gives utterance.
(Acts 2:1-4; 8:14-17; 10:44-45; Galatians 3:14-15)
10. We believe in the operation of the gifts and ministries of the Spirit as enumerated in 1 Corinthians 12-14 and Ephesians 4, as manifested in the early Church.
11. We believe in the Spirit-filled life, a life of separation from the world and perfecting of holiness in the fear of God as expressing the true Christian faith.
(Ephesians 5:18; 2 Corinthians 6:14; 7:1)
12. We believe in the healing of the body by Divine power, or Divine healing in its varied aspects as practised in the early Church (Acts 4:30; Romans 8:11; 1 Corinthians 12:9; James 5:14) and by deliverance in the name of Jesus.
(Mark 16:17)
Personal Opinion: Yes the Church believes in healing, miracles and exorcism.
13. We believe in the table of the Lord, commonly called the Communion or the Lord's Supper, for believers.
(1 Corinthians 11:28-32; Matthew 26:26-2
14. We believe in the reality and personality of the Devil and eternal judgment in the Lake of Fire for the Devil and his angels.
(Matthew 25:41; Revelation 20:14-15)
15. We believe in the eternal life for believers (John 5:24 ; 3:16 ), and eternal punishment for the unbelievers.
(Mark 9:43-48; 2 Thessalonians 1:9; Revelation 20:10-15)
Personal Opinion: That settles it, non-believers go to hell - period. Not happy, you can flame, but the statement stands. For one, I didn't even write it.
16. We believe that there is one true universal Church, made up of genuine believers, but this one universal Church is also composed of many local Churches in given localities. These Churches are under the sovereign headship of the Lord Jesus Christ, exercising autonomous government under Him, administering all its local affairs and ministry, as well as the propagation of the gospel.
(Acts 15:22; Matthew 16:18; 18:15-20)
Personal Opinion: There are many Harvest family Churches in SE Asia, included related/funded orphanages, schools, etc. A large portion of the member's offerings goes into this - not just that building.
17. We believe that Government is ordained of God, and the powers that be are ordained as ministers of God to us for good. To resist the powers and the ordinances is to resist the ordinance of God. We are subject not only for wrath sake but for conscience sake, rendering to all their dues, custom to whom custom, fear to whom fear, honor to whom honor. We declare our loyalty to our Government and its leaders, and will assist in every way possible, consistent with our faith in the scriptures as Christian citizens.
(Romans 13)
Personal Opinion: Romans eh? Yah, someone was wondering how come ISD didn't treat CHC as a cult?
Well, I'm sure this will be useful, whether you are a believer or not, CHC or not, its better that you can put your argument with some substance with understanding of what you are talking about - rather than screaming OMG! THEY ARE BRAINWASHED! OMG! BURN THEM! things like that.[/b] -
btw...issit illegal to spread religion in singapore? jus asking.
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I got the same experience. My friend from CHC keep calling me n pestering me to go to her church as if trying to do some sales or selling insurance. I keep rejecting her saying tat i not interested. She dun give up until a point whereby she send me 3 invitation card. The moment i receive it, i juz throw away. feel like asking her dun waste money on card, postal service etc, use the money to help the needy in steadOriginally posted by hxm:i had a neighbour who PESTERED me for dunno how many weeks to go to the SO-CALLED CARNIVAL. in the end had to sit thru some SERVICE. n she told me she didn't KNOW about it. wtf??!?!?!?!?!? sorry no offense. -
I got the same experience. My friend from CHC keep calling me n pestering me to go to her church as if trying to do some sales or selling insurance. I keep rejecting her saying tat i not interested. She dun give up until a point whereby she send me 3 invitation card. The moment i receive it, i juz throw away. feel like asking her dun waste money on card, postal service etc, use the money to help the needy in steadOriginally posted by hxm:i had a neighbour who PESTERED me for dunno how many weeks to go to the SO-CALLED CARNIVAL. in the end had to sit thru some SERVICE. n she told me she didn't KNOW about it. wtf??!?!?!?!?!? sorry no offense. -
i agree!Originally posted by Mr Fugue:Now I understand why it's called "city HARVEST"; they "harvest" funds from the city... -
same.. have a few friends who go there.. and i was pissed when they kept asking me to join them..Originally posted by Ogbunwezeh:I got the same experience. My friend from CHC keep calling me n pestering me to go to her church as if trying to do some sales or selling insurance. I keep rejecting her saying tat i not interested. She dun give up until a point whereby she send me 3 invitation card. The moment i receive it, i juz throw away. feel like asking her dun waste money on card, postal service etc, use the money to help the needy in stead -
I mean the way that you do it totally wrong. Someone or rather your friends spend his/her time to buy the stamp and wrote something for you and you just throw it away,just by doing that. How would you feel when someone did that do you?
You are being self-centered. The reason why they ask you to go is because they are concern about your life. If you think life is about me,myself. Then you are really self-fish. I tell you if your friend don't care about you, they won't ask you go even if you die, they don't even care.
People invite you just go lah, as if it will kill you and asking you to go and NOT asking you to accept their religion. Nobody force you too even for your friend. You think you are so great? Who you think you are, ask you so many times, many of the times are rejected. Ask yourself this question, what for they spend they money and time on you. What benefit do they have? How would you feel when people reject you.
One last thing, and many times I have to say it again. If you do not belong to that church, please do not say something you THINK it is correct. They have their own belief too. They don't believe in money will drop from heaven but by sowing and reaping,just a farmer planting a seed and in due season, they will reap to a good fruit will can use it to sell.
That also goes for other churches as well, don't say something that as if you know everything from there. There are a lot of things you still donno. If you think you know, then you are nothing more then a denier. -
Kid, put it this way, you care for someone, you expect NOTHING in return, i am sure you know that, people throw away your mail without reading, you should still graciously take this fact as it is God that is rejected, not you, making a fuss out of it is just plain un-Christ like.Originally posted by dO|pH|n3 a.k.a JaMiE:I mean the way that you do it totally wrong. Someone or rather your friends spend his/her time to buy the stamp and wrote something for you and you just throw it away,just by doing that. How would you feel when someone did that do you?
You are being self-centered. The reason why they ask you to go is because they are concern about your life. If you think life is about me,myself. Then you are really self-fish. I tell you if your friend don't care about you, they won't ask you go even if you die, they don't even care.
People invite you just go lah, as if it will kill you and asking you to go and NOT asking you to accept their religion. Nobody force you too even for your friend. You think you are so great? Who you think you are, ask you so many times, many of the times are rejected. Ask yourself this question, what for they spend they money and time on you. What benefit do they have? How would you feel when people reject you.
One last thing, and many times I have to say it again. If you do not belong to that church, please do not say something you THINK it is correct. They have their own belief too. They don't believe in money will drop from heaven but by sowing and reaping,just a farmer planting a seed and in due season, they will reap to a good fruit will can use it to sell.
That also goes for other churches as well, don't say something that as if you know everything from there. There are a lot of things you still donno. If you think you know, then you are nothing more then a denier.
you say people invite you just go lah, lol, not like you don't know how aggressive your church is, i was there once, some christmas thingy, then need to leave early as my church's own service there need me do something, one of your usher just come over and tell me "our pastor don't like people leaving half way". Tell me, is this the way to treat a newcomer? My Dad is the IC of our church's FTA(first time attender) ministry, and we all know the basic fact that you give the newcomer the best impression, we are not self centred people, we are God centred people. what is it with comments like "our pastor don't like it'??
and lastly, are you sure what you said is pleasing to God's eye? seriously, i do not wish to start an argument with you, i just hope you can think about what you are saying, really.
To the other non-CHCers: pai seh guys, got to talk THEIR language lah, or else cannot get thru to them one :p -
Originally posted by dO|pH|n3 a.k.a JaMiE:I mean the way that you do it totally wrong. Someone or rather your friends spend his/her time to buy the stamp and wrote something for you and you just throw it away,just by doing that. How would you feel when someone did that do you?
If this will be done onto you. How would you feel as a Christian?
You are being self-centered. The reason why they ask you to go is because they are concern about your life. If you think life is about me,myself. Then you are really self-fish. I tell you if your friend don't care about you, they won't ask you go even if you die, they don't even care.
Woah, the way you put it is as if you're doing me a favour by caring for my life. People don't think that they are in any state of self-centerness as like you've said. You're assuming too much. Tsk tsk, you should rephrase your message of 'passion' if you truly bother to correct people's mindset about your church.
People invite you just go lah, as if it will kill you and asking you to go and NOT asking you to accept their religion. Nobody force you too even for your friend. You think you are so great? Who you think you are, ask you so many times, many of the times are rejected. Ask yourself this question, what for they spend they money and time on you. What benefit do they have? How would you feel when people reject you.
Again, these people are inviting friends on their own accord. Ask yourself. If CHC have a good repute and proves to be a unbeliever friendly church, would people shun from havesters?
You claimed we are self centered.
Have you people as harvesters ever ask yourselves why aren't people/friends interested to attend your events/services but only out of obligation.
Ask yourself, at what expense do you take to see a soul getting saved?
Being Pushy?
Peer pressure tactics?
Many more which the other forumers can list out.
Ask yourself.
Why are people so unhappy with CHC...?
Why not other churches?
If invitation hold it's term. Then It is under the invitee's discretion to decide. What do you mean by 'You THINK YOU ARE SO GREAT?'
Dear Christian, i think you're not looking at a very christ-like position.
Becareful of what you're presenting here as a self profess spirit filled CHC christian.
Seems like some truths from ugly inner self is starting to reveal.
From doing the invitations and money and time out of good will/God's will/ Great Commision/ Love for people etc. Tsk tsk.
Indeed disappointing to hear some like this out from your mouth.
One last thing, and many times I have to say it again. If you do not belong to that church, please do not say something you THINK it is correct. They have their own belief too. They don't believe in money will drop from heaven but by sowing and reaping,just a farmer planting a seed and in due season, they will reap to a good fruit will can use it to sell.
If you think they are right, then i respect you.
If i think they are wrong. You respect me in return.
When you have any comments. Refute like a man and stop these emotional whining.
Of they have their own beliefs. We all can see that! By the aggresive means of Evangelising. It is indeed heartening to see such fervency!
No body believes in money dropping from heaven.
This the law of cause and Effect - Reaping and sowing.
Any Christian wih common sense will believe in the farmer's way too.
In fact, every living beings believes in this universal Law.
You tell me which orthodroxchurch believes in Money drop from heaven? I shall offer my apologies to you.
That also goes for other churches as well, don't say something that as if you know everything from there. There are a lot of things you still donno. If you think you know, then you are nothing more then a denier.
I question the methodology of evangelism and harvest. I respect the Leadership, they're intent i believe was out of a sincere and genuine heart. But somehow it got the wrong track hence passed down to the members which in turn friend would shun.
>>>Highlighted>>>I think you should reconsider to whom are you pointing this phrase to.
A person too strong in his own beliefs could be in denial too. Is that the true heart of God's Love you're presenting?
MC