What if there really is no "You"
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That is not a belief but a possiblity. The end result can be anything including the extermination of the human race or the next big advance to humanity. People are afraid of the possibility of the extreme end results.Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:... you can believe that, but it is only a belief... sentience, as yet is not understood, no one knows how sentience comes about although there are lots of theories floating around.... -
Possibilities are useless unless you have supporting evidence. There is a possibility that there is an alien mother ship coming to save a select few to escape from the imminent destruction of the earth to make way for the inter-galactic super-highway.Originally posted by Herzog_Zwei:That is not a belief but a possiblity. The end result can be anything including the extermination of the human race or the next big advance to humanity. People are afraid of the possibility of the extreme end results.
If you do not believe, why, there is a possibility that you might perish when earth is destroyed and remember, only a select few will survive because the alien mother ship cannot hold everyone and the aliens does not want to bring everyone along.
If you say that there is a possibility, then there must be some way to show that the possibility is grounded in reality. Otherwise the possibility is as good as a delusion.
I wonder if you know the concept of 'falsifiability' if not, you should google it.Falsifiability - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
When something is not falsifiable, it is useless to consider it other than for entertainment or for beliefs.
Falsifiability (or refutability or testability) is the logical possibility that an assertion can be shown false by an observation or a physical experiment. ...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falsifiability - 96k - Cached - Similar pages - Note this
God exists. Not falsifiable, useless other than as a belief.
The statement "the belief in God/ a God/ Lord Shiva/ Yahweh/ Ganesh/ Tua Peh Kong/ Jesus, is beneficial", that statement is falsifiable, and you can actually conduct an experiment to show whether the statement is true or false, it is "falsifiable".
Just that believers are not willing to agree on what constitute "proof" whether that statement is true or false.
For example, we can say the statement is "true" or "false" depending on whether praying to any or one or all of the God/s will result in a miracle. "no miracle, then false. Miracle, then true. The statement is falsifiable.
The believers are not so stupid as to do that, shatter their beliefs. So what they do is to define "beneficial" (in that context) to be unfalsifiable.
For example the believers can say, "it is beneficial if I feel that it is beneficial". That is unfalsifiable and if you define beneficial like that, then the original statement of unfalsifiable, and useless (other than as beliefs or entertainment, or to make you feel better).
So your sentience theory, is not falsifiable. Your theory that "The end result can be anything including the extermination of the human race or the next big advance to humanity" is not falsifiable and thus useless other than as a belief or for entertainment. -
I am not saying that you are wrong. I am taking about "mindfulness" and "awareness".Originally posted by An Eternal Now:The emphasis here as I said is on 'manifestation'
You are now mindful and aware that reality is a 'manifestation'. That it is an independent arising. That it is all well and good and true. (Emptiness)
Now what you must be mindful of and be aware of is that you are a, eating, sh!tting, sleeping, solid... living thing as well. (Form)
Now, how do you "combine" the two to become one? (Middle Way). hehehe that is the hard part but I can tell you, very rewarding. You can say that it is "enlightenment" when you can do that and to be able to do that, you have to be enlightened. -
Actually we can be immortal. But all yous limit your mind , believing that you will die. And your body ages and decays. Please .. OPEN YOUR MIND! If u still get old , decay and die is because u have not yet open your mind to transcend beyond death and into immorality.
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Unfalsifiable and therefore useless other than as a belief, entertainment and to make you feel better....Originally posted by BadzMaro:Actually we can be immortal. But all yous limit your mind , believing that you will die. And your body ages and decays. Please .. OPEN YOUR MIND! If u still get old , decay and die is because u have not yet open your mind to transcend beyond death and into immorality. -
i dunno where this argument as gone to... but i believe one phrase wraps up the idea that "there is no YOU"....
I think, therefore I am. -
Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:
Dependent arising.
I am not saying that you are wrong. I am taking about "mindfulness" and "awareness".
You are now mindful and aware that reality is a 'manifestation'. That it is an independent arising. That it is all well and good and true. (Emptiness)Now what you must be mindful of and be aware of is that you are a, eating, sh!tting, sleeping, solid... living thing as well. (Form)
Milarepa's Mahamudra
Now, how do you "combine" the two to become one? (Middle Way). hehehe that is the hard part but I can tell you, very rewarding. You can say that it is "enlightenment" when you can do that and to be able to do that, you have to be enlightened.
&
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Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:
Then again your theory of falsibility is wrong. Why? Because there is a inherent risk in doing and humanity is not willing to take the risk collectively.
When something is not falsifiable, it is useless to consider it other than for entertainment or for beliefs.
God exists. Not falsifiable, useless other than as a belief.
The statement [b]"the belief in God/ a God/ Lord Shiva/ Yahweh/ Ganesh/ Tua Peh Kong/ Jesus, is beneficial", that statement is falsifiable, and you can actually conduct an experiment to show whether the statement is true or false, it is "falsifiable".
Just that believers are not willing to agree on what constitute "proof" whether that statement is true or false.
For example, we can say the statement is "true" or "false" depending on whether praying to any or one or all of the God/s will result in a miracle. "no miracle, then false. Miracle, then true. The statement is falsifiable.
The believers are not so stupid as to do that, shatter their beliefs. So what they do is to define "beneficial" (in that context) to be unfalsifiable.
For example the believers can say, "it is beneficial if I feel that it is beneficial". That is unfalsifiable and if you define beneficial like that, then the original statement of unfalsifiable, and useless (other than as beliefs or entertainment, or to make you feel better).
So your sentience theory, is not falsifiable. Your theory that "The end result can be anything including the extermination of the human race or the next big advance to humanity" is not falsifiable and thus useless other than as a belief or for entertainment.[/b] -
Originally posted by starblue:i dunno where this argument as gone to... but i believe one phrase wraps up the idea that "there is no YOU"....
I think, therefore I am.Originally posted by AndrewPKYap: 24 December 2007 · 10:55 PM*sigh* ... "Cogito Ergo Sum" is superseded with the advent of new scientific knowledge.... why do you cling on to 400 years old philosophy?
Basically Descartes argument was that if he was fooled into thinking that he exists, there must be someone to fool and that someone is him, and that proves his existence.
... the problem with that is that he had no idea, at that time that it was possible that consciousness could emerge from simple interaction of neurons communicating at breakneck speed.
... there are now two main schools of thought and that is whether consciousness is purely an emergence of neurons or there is an ether in the universe (this ether being consciousness) that affects the neurons.
... sort of like, the voice you hear coming out of a radio does not come from a spirit or soul inside the radio but it comes from radio "electronics" but besides the radio electronics, there are radio waves that the radio electronics receives.
... so there are two things at work... the radio electronics and the radio waves in the ether...
... and if the radio "dies" it cannot receive the radio waves just as when a man dies, he cannot receive the "consciousness that permeates the universe"...
... nobody is looking at "Cogito Ergo Sum" anymore... it is superseded. -
The point is, you have a life to live and you continue to be a living human being. Buddhism can help you live a better, happier life. It is not about escaping into Emptiness, where reality is nothing but a luminous ball of light and denying what you see around you.Originally posted by An Eternal Now: -
[QUOTE=untermensche;5064520]Even if we accept that "I" is somewhere in my body, whatever that means, since there is no way to find "I" when dissecting a body, we are still left with the question; Where is my body?
We know we are on a planet within a galaxy within a universe, but we have no idea where the universe is? So we really don't know where our bodies are either.[/QUOTE] -
A Happier New Year for you Unker!! and hope you dont whine so much this year.No "you" but still got 'Me' wat
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Philosophy is not whinning.... is it trying to see reality for what it is....Originally posted by Short Ninja:A Happier New Year for you Unker!! and hope you dont whine so much this year.No "you" but still got 'Me' wat -
.... your incessant complaining of this thread, now, that is whinning...
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Why are we here? Why are we born onto this world?
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Pointing At Your No-FaceOriginally posted by AndrewPKYap:[QUOTE=untermensche;5064520]Even if we accept that "I" is somewhere in my body, whatever that means, since there is no way to find "I" when dissecting a body, we are still left with the question; Where is my body?
We know we are on a planet within a galaxy within a universe, but we have no idea where the universe is? So we really don't know where our bodies are either.[/QUOTE] -
... the most logical and rational conclusion is that, just as there is no 'you' (you are a concept, an aggregate), there is no 'why' or 'meaning' that is inherent.Originally posted by redstone:Why are we here? Why are we born onto this world?
What that means is that you 'develop', 'create', your own meaning.... (some people create 'beliefs' to give their lives meaning) but it is better to create your own meaning that is real and not meaning that is dependent on beliefs... -
... if you create meaning that depends on beliefs instead of reality... you have to keep reminding yourself what exactly it is that you believe... you congregate remind one another and do strange things before eating and going to bed...
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Isn't that what are you doing now?Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:... if you create meaning that depends on beliefs instead of reality... you have to keep reminding yourself what exactly it is that you believe... you congregate remind one another and do strange things before eating and going to bed... -
And you're all still going on at it? Now I believe the term a leopard never changes its spot. Happy New YearOriginally posted by Herzog_Zwei:Isn't that what are you doing now? -
Same to you, bloody leopard.Originally posted by kitkat_:And you're all still going on at it? Now I believe the term a leopard never changes its spot. Happy New Year